NBN Rollout Scrapped

[joea]

On Four Corners (i think ) Monday night we have Conroy and NBN.
Cheers

 

[So_Cynical]

At the retail level, comparison between Internode's ADSL2+ plans and their NBN fibre plans make for interesting reading.

http://www.internode.on.net/residential/adsl_broadband/easy_broadband/
http://www.internode.on.net/residential/fibre_to_the_home/nbn_plans/

Even at the entry level, the NBN plans become much more expensive than the ADSL2+ plans as the GB's go up. For example, 200GB entry level NBN is as expensive as 600GB ADSL2+, unbundled.

Dr .. can you and other under informed posters in this thread please stop it with the bulls!it comparisons and other scare tactics...the above download quota comparison is a apples and oranges comparison.
~

 

[trainspotter]

Ummmmmmm why is it they are using the MAXIMUM NBN can provide and the MINIMUM that ADSL2 can provide?? Huh ??? Read the comparison carefully. "Theoretical peak download NBN" vs "Minimum speed Internode" ........ they are talking about SPEED which has FUGGAL to do with the amounts can downloaded for a price.


Apples and Oranges my @rse.

 

[So_Cynical]

Ummmmmmm why is it they are using the MAXIMUM NBN can provide and the MINIMUM that ADSL2 can provide?? Huh ??? Read the comparison carefully. "Theoretical peak download NBN" vs "Minimum speed Internode" ........ they are talking about SPEED which has FUGGAL to do with the amounts can downloaded for a price.


Apples and Oranges my @rse.

I used the NBN maximum because thats all i could find...please feel free to trawl the internode site and post up the minimum speeds if you can find them.

I quoted the minimum speed for DSL because its very relevant to the "easy" Internode plan (i was actually on this plan for 3 years) under the T&C agreement that's the minimum Internode guarantee so is at the core of the pricing model.

Found some speed info for the Easy plan

* 13.4% achieve a download synch speed of higher than 20 Mbps
* 27.7% achieve a download synch speed of between 15 Mbps and 20 Mbps
* 22.1% achieve a download synch speed of between 10 Mbps and 15 Mbps
* 23.0% achieve a download synch speed of between 5 Mbps and 10 Mbps
* 13.8% achieve a download synch speed of less than 5 Mbps

http://www.internode.on.net/residential/adsl_broadband/easy_broadband/performance/

Anyway clearly apples and oranges with NBN around 14 > 18 times faster.

 

[trainspotter]

Sure thing it is faster. This was not the issue at hand.

600MB = $109.95 = ADSL2

200MB = $109.95 = NBN

You download quicker and reach your $$$ spend download quicker as well. The dollar spend on ADSL2 you get more bang for your buck. Yes yes yes it is slower but unless you are video conferencing or gaming ........ WHO CARES?

Maximum "theoretical" NBN vs Minimum "proven" ADSL ??? Now this is definitely apples and oranges country ???

 

[sptrawler]

The other thing that has to be factored in is the capital outlay. Approx $40 billion to give you what you already have just faster what does Joe average need super high speed internet for. Is there anything that you are desperate to download that you have to have it 5 minutes quicker.

 

[trainspotter]

In the time for sptrawler to respond I have purchased and paid for 4 items on ebay, logged into the security system of my shop for a live feed, downloaded 14 emails (8meg), watched a trailer for Hangover 2 on youtube and done my internet banking and replied to this thread. Yeppers ..... lets spend 26 billion of my money to do this faster.

 

[nulla nulla]

In the time for sptrawler to respond I have purchased and paid for 4 items on ebay, logged into the security system of my shop for a live feed, downloaded 14 emails (8meg), watched a trailer for Hangover 2 on youtube and done my internet banking and replied to this thread. Yeppers ..... lets spend 26 billion of my money to do this faster.

And that is just the benefit for one user. Conservatively, multiply it by 2.5 million users and then work out the national improvement in financial productivity. Nevermind the kiddies on facebook or the dorks downloading pr0n, the benefit to business is huge.

 

[JTLP]

In the time for sptrawler to respond I have purchased and paid for 4 items on ebay, logged into the security system of my shop for a live feed, downloaded 14 emails (8meg), watched a trailer for Hangover 2 on youtube and done my internet banking and replied to this thread. Yeppers ..... lets spend 26 billion of my money to do this faster.

Look mate you'll be happy when you get than extra item on ebay for only $40 billion more ok? For an extra $10 billion i'll give you an extra email. Uncosted will be another trailer if you want to watch it.

You're all whingers - let's build 2 NBN's so we can go even faster!

 

[trainspotter]

The little Toshiba laptop will require a hyperdrive retro fitted to keep up !! The smoke is billowing out of it now with so much pressure in just 4 minutes !!

Seriously though ........ I applaud the NBN Co for cancelling the tender process as the costings/tenders were too high. I have repeatedly said ....... "I WANT MY NBN ...... but not at ANY cost"

I don't know how the download speed would have made it any faster? You can only read and type and take in so much info at one time.

 

[Julia]

I don't know how the download speed would have made it any faster? You can only read and type and take in so much info at one time.

Zackly. Something which seems to be little recognised.

 

[nulla nulla]

Seriously though ........ I applaud the NBN Co for cancelling the tender process as the costings/tenders were too high. I have repeatedly said ....... "I WANT MY NBN ...... but not at ANY cost"

I was pleasantly surprised to see Conroy tell the gaugers where to get off. Maybe there is hope yet.

 

[medicowallet]

the benefit to business is huge.

Ok so please show me this,

because the many business owners I have talked to have said that faster internet will make no difference to their business, and major corporations and large businesses already have access to fast internet.

For example, which of the following businesses are hamstrung by ADSL2?

Pharmacy
Doctors
Butcher
Mechanic
Plumber
Baker
Video store

In fact, can you just give me some examples of small-medium businesses who have productivity dependant upon their internet speed, because I can only think of a miniscule handful.

As I said, large businesses already can get fast speeds.

A lot this increased productivity touted is clearly overstated.

I can understand that a few businesses will benefit, but for $40+ billion!!!

$20 billion into services = hospitals, schools
$10 billion into tertiary education and R&D
$10 billion into roads and ports

would no doubt give a much better ROI and revenue streams to allow future investment in other areas of productivity.

 

[trainspotter]

Old lady digging for "scrap" cuts fibre optic cable

GEORGIAN police arrested a 75-year-old woman who single-handedly cut off internet connections in Georgia and neighbouring Armenia, the interior ministry in Tbilisi said today.

The pensioner was digging for scrap metal when she hacked into a fibre-optic cable which runs through Georgia to Armenia, forcing many thousands of Internet users in both countries offline for several hours on March 28.

Many Georgians' internet connections were also briefly cut in 2009 by another scavenger who damaged the fibre-optic cable while hunting for scrap metal in the impoverished ex-Soviet state.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...armenia-internet/story-e6frep1o-1226035351932

Lets hope that Australilalala land doesn't become impoverished

 

[So_Cynical]

The other thing that has to be factored in is the capital outlay. Approx $40 billion to give you what you already have just faster what does Joe average need super high speed internet for. Is there anything that you are desperate to download that you have to have it 5 minutes quicker.

Pretty sure there would of been a similar argument about the car replacing the horse and electric lights replacing whale oil powered lamps....seriously.

The first cars were slow and cumbersome, noisy made strange smells and drove on roads designed and built for horses and cost alot of money, there would of been alot of opinion in favour of the good old trusty horse, probably would of made more short term financial sense to stick with horses too.

You Can't Stop Progress...its inevitable.

 

[sails]

...You Can't Stop Progress...its inevitable.

So, over the next few years while they are slowly digging up the ground and laying cable, it is quite possible that new technology providing more reliable and fast wireless might beat them to it.

Absolutely have to let progress happen. Seems pretty silly to slow progress down with something expensive that may be antiquated before it's even finished.

It seems a big gamble with $36b - or with blowouts maybe $60b of taxpayer funds.

 

[Slipperz]

Pretty sure there would of been a similar argument about the car replacing the horse and electric lights replacing whale oil powered lamps....seriously.

The first cars were slow and cumbersome, noisy made strange smells and drove on roads designed and built for horses and cost alot of money, there would of been alot of opinion in favour of the good old trusty horse, probably would of made more short term financial sense to stick with horses too.

You Can't Stop Progress...its inevitable.

That's why the US plan to sell tv spectrum for wireless broadband makes so much sense to me. In the major population centres with improved technology wireless will do the job without having to dig a trench to every door.

 

[boofhead]

A major reason Internode list minimum speeds for ADSL and maximum for fibre is because of line speed differences. ADSL available through Telstra only has assurances for minimum speeds - anything over is a bonus and Telstra won't do much to improve speeds. Fibre gives you the listed speed.

NBNCo will enable multicast. Telstra does not provide this to wholesale clients. This allows bandwidth efficient ways to deploy various data streaming services like TV over IP. FetchTV would be one some Australians may be aware of that is currently available. iiNet and Internode offer it. Internode have limits applied to those on Telstra ports.

Hopefully the cancelled fibre tender process can be resolved.

Slipperz: Recent ABS figures showed that wireless isn't displacing wired. They are often used to compliment. It should also be noted wireless is still a developing market whereas wired is reasonably mature - basically saturated.


As for wireless technologies in the next couple of years improving - while discoveries may happen the general rollout to consumers is many years behind. CSIROs recent wireless systems in testing will be useful though.

Some areas are not well suited to terrestial wireless because of geography and geology. While different it can provide some analogies - free to air coverage in Tasmania. Lots of hills and valleys along the coastlines with forests.

 

[trainspotter]

Natural progression and advancement in technologies is inevitable. Spending 40 billion or thereabouts of taxpayers money on a nation building exercise is not the same as replacing motorcars or electric lamps.

They owned a Telco company once and sold it off and cited the reason that Government should not be a monopoly phone carrier system and now they are going straight back to the same model.

We need better roads, rail systems, water purification, hospitals, police stations, schools and universitites BEFORE we need a shiny blue cable.

Conroy is comparing us to South Korea as a litmus test for the case of the NBN.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...tional-broadband/story-e6frg9if-1226004670045

1) We don't have 49 million people
2) We don't have high speed trains
3) Our population density is not the same
4) We are an export of minerals based economy
5) South Korea is a technology based economy

 

[drsmith]

Pretty sure there would of been a similar argument about the car replacing the horse and electric lights replacing whale oil powered lamps....seriously.

Did I hit a raw nerve yesterday ?

The success of the car (internal combustion engine) and electricity resulted from technological advances that made the underlying commodity (energy) cheaper.

In the case of the NBN, the raw commodity (quota) is becoming more expensive. The increase is essentially the tax we are being required to pay to fund its construction.