Health Reform: Where is it heading?

[trainspotter]

I can hardly wait for the first patient to wake up with a pair of scissors still left inside them after an operation. I wonder if there is enough monies left in the grab bag to payout the malpractice suit? Rudd offers another 15 billion to sweeten the deal to get the Premiers to sign on the dotted line. Where is the money coming from again? Anyone seen any forecasts or details as to how the GST is funding this parallel commonwealth bureaucracy gone mad? How is is it decided that the GST funds are split up? Let's say that WA contributes a majority of GST revenue due to mining etc but has the least amount of population. Does this mean this state is worse off or better off under Herr Rudds health plan? Is there a surplus of GST revenue and if so where does it go? STILL NO DETAILS other than 30% of GST taken away from state control and allegedly being placed back into health ??

"As Prime Minister, I was elected with a mandate to deliver better health and hospital services for all Australians," Chairman Rudd thundered. OOoooooer ... sounds like the Supreme Leader has spoken.

 

[noco]

Yes I am surprised it was only 60%. I have never met anybody who doesn't want health reform. It was however the wrong question.

If the question had been,

Would you trust this government to implement a cost efficient health reform plan?

Rudd would have got whacked.

Yes Calliope, that is the question I would like to see in a referendum, but there is no way it will happen.

The thing I cannot understand is why Rudd needs a referendum in the first place. He has the constitutional power to take over the whole system. He said he would do it in July 2009 if the states did not improve. Why has he reneged?

 

[trainspotter]

Just received this email.

Subject: Kevin Rudd's Health Plan

As a rule, I don't pass along these "add your name" lists that appear in emails, BUT this one is important.

It has been circulating for months and has been sent to over 20 million people.

We don't want to lose any names on the list so just hit forward and send it on.

Please keep it going!

To show your support for Kevin Rudd's health care reform, please go to the end of the list and add your name.


1. Wayne Swan.

2.

 

[noco]

Just received this email.

Subject: Kevin Rudd's Health Plan

As a rule, I don't pass along these "add your name" lists that appear in emails, BUT this one is important.

It has been circulating for months and has been sent to over 20 million people.

We don't want to lose any names on the list so just hit forward and send it on.

Please keep it going!

To show your support for Kevin Rudd's health care reform, please go to the end of the list and add your name.


1. Wayne Swan.

2.

1. Wayne Swan
2. So Cynical
3. I Focus.

 

[Calliope]

Rudd is using his tried and true methods to gain support from the premiers. If bribes work on the electorate why shouldn't shelling out billions of the taxpayers' money work on the premiers? The gutless Bligh, Rann and Bartlett have already folded. Apparently they are just getting rewarded.

In an attempt to ease tensions, NSW will be handed the lion's share of an unprecedented national funding package, worth an extra $15.6 billion, under which the Commonwealth will lock in cast-iron health funding increases of 8.3 per cent a year.

Victoria, where political resistance is strongest to the reforms, is to be offered an extra $3.8 billion, Queensland an extra $3.4 billion and South Australia $1.1 billion. The remaining billions are to be shared out between the ACT, Western Australia, Tasmania and the Northern Territories.

http://www.news.com.au/national/kev...xtra-health-cash/story-e6frfkvr-1225855245959

 

[trainspotter]

1. Wayne Swan
2. So Cynical
3. I Focus.

LOL@noco ... too funny

 

[noco]

One can't help feeling suspicious that our Prime Minister Kevin Rudd has a hidden agenda for wanting to push his undetailed health reform before the release of the Henry tax reveiw and the budget.

We may well be in for some surprises leading up to the election.

 

[Julia]

One can't help feeling suspicious that our Prime Minister Kevin Rudd has a hidden agenda for wanting to push his undetailed health reform before the release of the Henry tax reveiw and the budget.

We may well be in for some surprises leading up to the election.

Yes, I agree. The millions (?billions) he's throwing around to bribe the Premiers appear at this stage to be unfunded, other than that which is to be clawed back from the States' GST.

I'll be very surprised indeed if the release of the Henry Tax Review (or parts thereof, given our Prime Minister seems to have a predilection for feeding out little bits at a time of everything) does not contain some politically unpalatable new taxes.

If the Premiers sign up to Rudd's Plan before they know the content of the Henry Review, they're even greater fools than they've so far demonstrated.

 

[IFocus]

Seems I struck a nerve

So I take it none of you have read the policy just the media headlines!

 

[Whiskers]

I can hardly wait for the first patient to wake up with a pair of scissors still left inside them after an operation. I wonder if there is enough monies left in the grab bag to payout the malpractice suit? Rudd offers another 15 billion to sweeten the deal to get the Premiers to sign on the dotted line. Where is the money coming from again? Anyone seen any forecasts or details as to how the GST is funding this parallel commonwealth bureaucracy gone mad? How is is it decided that the GST funds are split up? Let's say that WA contributes a majority of GST revenue due to mining etc but has the least amount of population. Does this mean this state is worse off or better off under Herr Rudds health plan? Is there a surplus of GST revenue and if so where does it go? STILL NO DETAILS other than 30% of GST taken away from state control and allegedly being placed back into health ??

"As Prime Minister, I was elected with a mandate to deliver better health and hospital services for all Australians," Chairman Rudd thundered. OOoooooer ... sounds like the Supreme Leader has spoken.

Intergovernmental Agreement on Federal Financial Relations.

NO.

Talk about half-cocked Rabble-Rousers!

Don't even know the basics that are enshrined in the system.

 

[Whiskers]

One can't help feeling suspicious that our Prime Minister Kevin Rudd has a hidden agenda for wanting to push his undetailed health reform before the release of the Henry tax reveiw and the budget.

We may well be in for some surprises leading up to the election.

Maybe, many politicans do, but the state premiers obviously have a lot more detail than is available to the public and equally, counter propositions which they're also not revealing (maybe because it may embarrass them or highlight their grand-standing)... and it's reasonable as has often happened at COAG meetings under all political persuasions to thrash out agreements albeit at the last minute so they can be factored into the Fed budget.

Doesn't seem anything unusual in that respect.

 

[Whiskers]

If the Premiers sign up to Rudd's Plan before they know the content of the Henry Review, they're even greater fools than they've so far demonstrated.

Why so?

From the little info available, the main thrust is are not about takeing over the day to day management of health services, but about some sort of standardisation of services, and funding of health services across the country, particularly to attempt to rectify the imbalance in some regional areas, by taking 30% of current state GST and putting into some fund specifically for health delivery services.

The gov may impliment some of the Henry Review recommendations re the spread of wealth in terms of income tax and welfare, but how could the Henry Review adversly affect state budgets, since the GST cannot be changed without the states agreeing?

 

[Calliope]

Talk about half-cocked Rabble-Rousers!

Don't even know the basics that are enshrined in the system.

Talk about gullible fools.

Whatever happened to health system reform? They are certainly not discussing it in Canberra. It is on the back burner.

As with all COAG meetings it has descended into a bun fight over money. Like vultures they are fighting over their share of the taxpayers' carcase. Brumby says they can't discuss reform until until they sort the money out.

The aged, the infirm and the mentally ill should be very worried.

Every time Rudd opens his mouth to put another "sweetener" on the table, Swan has to rule a line under his Budget proposals and start again. The allocation for Rudd's bribes is reaching massive proportions.

 

[Whiskers]

Talk about gullible fools.

Yes they are. Have a bit of a read. http://www.coag.gov.au/intergov_agreements/federal_financial_relations/index.cfm

Whatever happened to health system reform? They are certainly not discussing it in Canberra. It is on the back burner.

Well you may be right there. It seems a couple of states are now complicating things and want to change at the last moment the previously agreed IGA on the GST distribution, before discussing anything else.

But the states have been in discussion with the fed for two previous years over health reform at COAG. You can't tell me they are completely ignorant on what the fed is looking for. Time to get something on the ground at least in the way of standardisation of services. I suspect the states are still baulking on tying up funds in Specific Purpose Payments.

As with all COAG meetings it has descended into a bun fight over money. Like vultures they are fighting over their share of the taxpayers' carcase.

So what's new there!

Brumby says they can't discuss reform until until they sort the money out

Well from my accounting experience you have to have a plan before you can fund it... or is he one wanting to go right back to changing the IGA formula at the last moment.

The aged, the infirm and the mentally ill should be very worried.

Why so?

Every time Rudd opens his mouth to put another "sweetener" on the table, Swan has to rule a line under his Budget proposals and start again. The allocation for Rudd's bribes is reaching massive proportions.

Again what's new here. Every gov does that at COAG negotiations. That's what COAG is all about.


http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/03/26/2199066.htm

 

[Calliope]

Why so?

Because health system reform seems to have disappeared from the agenda.

The gullibility of you and the other usual suspects on this thread is a mystery to me. After all Rudd's lies, broken promises, foul-ups and squandering our economic base, you still have faith in his promises. You accept Rudd-spin as gospel.

I can only assume that you, along with the other true believers, have a vested interest and are a beneficiary of the loot that Rudd has raided from the public purse.

You say you have accounting experience. Well it's about time you did your sums, and see if you can balance the books. Swan has no chance.

 

[noco]

Seems I struck a nerve

So I take it none of you have read the policy just the media headlines!

Is that the one Rudd wrote on the back of an envelope a couple of weeks ago. Can you give us a link?

 

[Whiskers]

Because health system reform seems to have disappeared from the agenda.

What!

I believe I saw Brumby on early morning TV saying discussions have been positive and we might get an agreement today. Quite a turnaround from yesterdays rethoric.

 

[noco]

Yes they are. Have a bit of a read. http://www.coag.gov.au/intergov_agreements/federal_financial_relations/index.cfm



Well you may be right there. It seems a couple of states are now complicating things and want to change at the last moment the previously agreed IGA on the GST distribution, before discussing anything else.

But the states have been in discussion with the fed for two previous years over health reform at COAG. You can't tell me they are completely ignorant on what the fed is looking for. Time to get something on the ground at least in the way of standardisation of services. I suspect the states are still baulking on tying up funds in Specific Purpose Payments.



So what's new there!



Well from my accounting experience you have to have a plan before you can fund it... or is he one wanting to go right back to changing the IGA formula at the last moment.



Why so?



Again what's new here. Every gov does that at COAG negotiations. That's what COAG is all about.


http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/03/26/2199066.htm

Yes, like everything else this Government does, TALK! TALK! SPIN!SPIN! AND NO ACTION. They won't even get half way like all their other promises.

 

[Whiskers]

Yes, like everything else this Government does, TALK! TALK! SPIN!SPIN! AND NO ACTION. They won't even get half way like all their other promises.

BUT... the fed gov isn't managing the day to day delivery of health services. That is still in the hands of the States.

Isn't the main jist of these negotiations to secure health funding probably as a larger SPP, that can't be redirected to other areas eg leaving health supplies low because of unpaid suppliers as in NSW, BUT still managed and delivered by the states, but to some sort of national standard?

Surely once agreement on the standards and funding is agreed, it's all up to the states to deliver/manage as usual as per the agreed standards and funding.

 

[Calliope]

Isn't the main jist of these negotiations to secure health funding probably as a larger SPP, that can't be redirected to other areas eg leaving health supplies low because of unpaid suppliers as in NSW, BUT still managed and delivered by the states, but to some sort of national standard?

No the "main jist (sic)" is about the Commonwealth imposing another layer of bureaucracy on the system. Whoever controls the funding will call the tune.

Nothing will change. Commonwealth bureaucrats always bungle management, and running a cost effective health system is beyond them. Pouring in more money doesn't help. It just goes down the gurgler as in the BER.