Victorian Fires

[daisy]

This is a cracker. Media and real estate agents becrying 'ruthless property investors'. Takes a vulture to know a vulture?

Err I would say if i was sitting on a burnt-out block of ash and dirt I would be fielding all offers. It is a market that has been beset by a 'black swan event' after all - prices must go down in the short to medium term.


From The Scum:
RUTHLESS property investors are swooping on bushfire victims to buy their devastated land.

Disgusted real estate agents told the Herald Sun they were fielding calls from predators seeking cheap "scorched land for sale".

Greedy landlords also have been caught trying to rent overpriced rooms to survivors who have lost everything.

These kinds of events always bring out the best and the worst in people don't they?
On the one hand there's donations coming in from all over Oz, and on the other there's looters and someone making fraudulent claims.
Human nature never ceases to amaze me.

 

[kincella]

uh hmmm...I live 500 yards from the MIGHTY Yarra River....thats right,its right here in the middle of Melbourne...and it all runs out to sea....no dams, no nothing...not retrieve any of it to water all our parks and gardens...

Hello Brumby.....you and Tim Holden too busy doing photo sessions to notice....
its a mighty river...full to the brim...??? how many metres wide...but its big and full of water...
dont hold your breath....the state govt would rather build a desalination plant...obviously to keep their mates earning millions...desalination is the most expensive form of obtaining water....
they will not build a dam anywhere.....
but they will build a pipe and take the little bit of water left in the drought stricken areas from the local farmers.. surely you have seen the news on that one...
if it is a ridiculous answer.....you bet thats the way they will go....
anything sensible...no way

 

[Calliope]

The organisers expect a record turnout for tomorrow's national day of mourning for the fire victims.

It cannot be expected that any expressions of sorrow will ever exceed the "outpourings of grief" that followed the death of princess Di. We are grieving the death of over 200 people who died in tragic circumstances, over which most of them had no control.

The princess died as a result of getting into a car with a drunk driver.

 

[daisy]

I feel sick.

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1009283/Anti-gay-protesters-to-picket-bushfire-memorial
Anti-gay protesters to picket bushfire memorial
Members of a controversial anti-gay church group from the US say they plan to picket outside a memorial service for the victims of the deadly Victorian bushfires.

The Westboro Baptist Church is notorious for protesting at the funerals of soldiers killed in Iraq, claiming their deaths are 'punishment' for America's tolerance of homosexuality.

The Kansas-based group, headed by fanatical pastor Fred Phelps, was banned from entering the UK earlier this week - and has now turned its attention to Australia.

In a statement, the church said: "The guilty Australians will not repent of their national sins of the flesh - (ie sodomy, divorce, fornication, adultery, etc) - even after God killed hundreds in the fires and cast them into hotter fire and brimstone in Hell.

"Therefore we will picket them in their hypocritical grief."

The statement, entitled "God hates Australia. Thank god for fiery deaths of hundreds", was posted on the group's website.

 

[spooly74]

I feel sick.

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1009283/Anti-gay-protesters-to-picket-bushfire-memorial
Anti-gay protesters to picket bushfire memorial

Unreal!
They plan to meet at Rod Laver Arena. I hope they get the **** kicked out of them.

 

[MrBurns]

Unreal!
They plan to meet at Rod Laver Arena. I hope they get the **** kicked out of them.

I think there's more than a fair chance of that happening, the police will take steps the stop this because everyone knows what will happen. I might get a deckchair and a sandwich and go watch. Nice day out.

 

[daisy]

This was lost.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/2581996/Brunos-Art-Sculpture-Garden

 

[Smurf1976]

uh hmmm...I live 500 yards from the MIGHTY Yarra River....thats right,its right here in the middle of Melbourne...and it all runs out to sea....no dams, no nothing...not retrieve any of it to water all our parks and gardens...
...

they will not build a dam anywhere...

Dams are to the greens what unions are to the Liberals, they would never be in favour of them no matter how strong the argument.

It was understood very well by dam building authorities in Australia 50 years ago (literally) that the public will welcome mass scale environmental destruction to build roads, cities and just about anything else. Except dams. Try building a dam and that's when all the protesters turn up.

The first environmental opposition to building a dam in Australia that I'm aware of was in the 1930's. That dam was built and is still there today. By the 1980's, the green vote was sufficiently important that dam construction all but ceased Australia wide.

Whilst a certain very well known (but incorrectly named by almost everyone) hydro-electric dam in Tasmania was the high profile test case, the results have been national. Same in Brisbane, Melbourne and just about everywhere else. Expansion of large scale water infrastructure effectively ceased in the 70's and 80's and now we're paying the price for not also halting population and economic growth at the same time.

 

[Smurf1976]

Im certain heads are going to roll in this royal commission .....



http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/754565/city-firies-banned-from-bushfires

That's ridiculous.

NSW, SA and Tas have sent an assortment of equipment, fire fighters, forestry workers and others with relevant fire fighting experience to Vic to help out. And you're telling me there are fire engines and professional fire fighters right there in Melbourne sitting around doing nothing?

Don't misunderstand me, I have no problem whatsoever with my state govt Fire Levy being used to help the situation in another state. No problem with that whatosever - it's one country after all. But I think the people of Victoria especially, plus the other states that have sent people in to help, deserve an explanation as to why on earth they aren't using the people and equipment already sitting there in Melbourne.

I'm no expert on Victoria's geography apart from a couple of regions. But I'd be pretty confident that fire engines and fire fighters based in Melbourne could have got to the fires a lot more quickly than those from Sydney, Adelaide or Hobart (or regional areas of those states with the possible exception of southern parts of NSW).

Surely this can't be true? Heads certainly ought to roll if it is.

 

[Calliope]

The first environmental opposition to building a dam in Australia that I'm aware of was in the 1930's. That dam was built and is still there today. By the 1980's, the green vote was sufficiently important that dam construction all but ceased Australia wide.

Whilst a certain very well known (but incorrectly named by almost everyone) hydro-electric dam in Tasmania was the high profile test case, the results have been national. Same in Brisbane, Melbourne and just about everywhere else. Expansion of large scale water infrastructure effectively ceased in the 70's and 80's and now we're paying the price for not also halting population and economic growth at the same time.

In SE Qld the Beatty government followed by the Bligh Government has pulled every trick in the book to avoid building a dam. They have spent millions on superstructure to recycle water which the public is reluctant to have put in the dams.

They have spent millions on electrolysis plants which are unusable because essential components are rusting up.

They have spent millions on a network of pipes connecting all the dams so so that Brisbane can access other people's water. It's supposed to work both ways, but I live on the Sunshine Coast where are dams are relatively small. To take our water is like a glutton taking a biscuit from baby. The baby will miss it, but it won't do the glutton much good. The crowning insult is that our water rates are increased to pay for it.

I know this may sound trivial to Southerners, but all this is happening so that Bligh will retain the Green preferences, which are her lifeline. She is a very cynical woman.

 

[Smurf1976]

I know this may sound trivial to Southerners

It's not trivial when you end up without enough water and the consequent water restrictions, dead gardens, fire hazards, structural damage to houses and so on. All that's doing quite a bit of damage to the environment too, by the way, especially when it comes to building damage.

I don't have a link or official reference for this, so you'll have to take my word for it or ignore me on this one. But one forecast I'm aware of puts the chances of an El Niño at around 60% for next Summer. Typically, an El Niño brings drought to Australia, something we're totally unprepared for in the southern parts of the country with the place already looking like a desert, water storage at low levels and so on.

Those areas that didn't burn this year could well end up burning next year - we need to do a LOT of fire reduction burning THIS coming Autumn, Winter and Spring when it can be done safely rather than waiting for another disastrous fire like has just happened in Vic.

Wake up people, this is a serious situation that requires clear thinking and urgent ACTION. Forget the inquiries, focus groups, steering committees and all the rest. Just get on with it and clear the fire hazards. We've got fire brigades, Parks and Wildlife services, local government, forestry companies and others who would be able to work out what to do if given orders to do so. And if need be, there's the Army, volunteers and a rising number of unemployed people who could help get it done.

Or are we going to be sitting here lamenting the losses from the next fire disaster in 2010, 2011 or whenever it comes? I hope not.

 

[Julia]

In SE Qld the Beatty government followed by the Bligh Government has pulled every trick in the book to avoid building a dam. They have spent millions on superstructure to recycle water which the public is reluctant to have put in the dams.

What about Traveston? Both Beattie and Bligh were determined to go ahead with this, but have since succumbed to Greens pressure.

They have spent millions on electrolysis plants which are unusable because essential components are rusting up.

They have spent millions on a network of pipes connecting all the dams so so that Brisbane can access other people's water. It's supposed to work both ways, but I live on the Sunshine Coast where are dams are relatively small. To take our water is like a glutton taking a biscuit from baby. The baby will miss it, but it won't do the glutton much good. The crowning insult is that our water rates are increased to pay for it.

Yes, this is the sort of shocking mismanagement that should see Bligh & Co thrown out. But I expect they will be re-elected, so uninspiring is the Springborg opposition.

It's not trivial when you end up without enough water and the consequent water restrictions, dead gardens, fire hazards, structural damage to houses and so on. All that's doing quite a bit of damage to the environment too, by the way, especially when it comes to building damage.

I don't have a link or official reference for this, so you'll have to take my word for it or ignore me on this one. But one forecast I'm aware of puts the chances of an El Niño at around 60% for next Summer.

Smurf I don't think you have to persuade anyone on this forum as to the logic of your comments. And quite apart from the hazards you describe above,
in the 21st century people should not have to let their gardens die and be restricted to short showers because successive governments have failed to build the necessary infrastructure.

 

[Calliope]

I went to bed last night thinking of John Brumby's statement re today's memorial service. He said that this is a great opportunity for all Australians to come together.

Yes, I thought , this could work. States will come together and in a spirit of cooperation we will drop our parochial attitudes and start thinking like Australians. We will work together and solve the country's big problems;

Our water problems,
Our bushfire problems,
Our infrastructure problems,
Our health problems
Our education problems, and all those other issues held back by State bickering.

And then I woke up.

Sadly, organised mournings are like organised talkfests. They make us feel good for a while. But it soon wears off

 

[MrBurns]

Day of mourning - I bet all those survivors living in tents wished it was a day of "get me back into a house" KRudd grandstanding as usual - was there a day of mourning for the Bali victims ?

 

[Prospector]

Day of mourning - I bet all those survivors living in tents wished it was a day of "get me back into a house" KRudd grandstanding as usual - was there a day of mourning for the Bali victims ?

The day of mourning for Bali victims is repeated every year in Bali. There was also a service in Adelaide today, just up from where I live. So I went for a wander, I reckon maybe 100 people were there?

I am sad for all of these people but I just do not feel the need to share a grieving memorial with them.

 

[MrBurns]

The day of mourning for Bali victims is repeated every year in Bali. There was also a service in Adelaide today, just up from where I live. So I went for a wander, I reckon maybe 100 people were there?

I am sad for all of these people but I just do not feel the need to share a grieving memorial with them.

Me either, I reckon a service for the locals where the tent city is in Yea would have been more appropriate.

A National day of Mourning is just over the top, these people would have been remembered at every church service in Australia , there was no need for this

 

[kincella]

more trouble with fires in the Warburton area expected tomorrow..Mon..I would think the Wilson Prom fires are still a problem..and any others still going
wonder if its too early for anyone to do anything any different from 2 weeks ago ?
although we have all these experts from overseas now...will people wait till the last minute again....

 

[Calliope]

Me either, I reckon a service for the locals where the tent city is in Yea would have been more appropriate.

A National day of Mourning is just over the top, these people would have been remembered at every church service in Australia , there was no need for this

It was encouraging to see that the fire ravaged communities preferred to attend local services where they could count on the support of their friends, neighbours and fellow victims rather than be transported to Rudd's extravaganza in Melbourne.

 

[MrBurns]

It was encouraging to see that the fire ravaged communities preferred to attend local services where they could count on the support of their friends, neighbours and fellow victims rather than be transported to Rudd's extravaganza in Melbourne.

Yes I think that shows that KRudd had the public mood wrong, they certainly grieve but not to the point of supporting this spectacle - Telstra Dome (or is it Vodaphone) was only half full.

 

[Bushman]

Warburton is being evacuated with up to 70% of residents fleeing the town.

Sadly this most horrid of bushfire seasons still has some way to go. Spare a thought today for the CFA workers who will be risking life and limb battling this blaze. Also the residents who will be facing the uncertainty of property loss.

Makes me very sad to see our once beautiful garden-state reduced to a smouldering ruin.