Your tax dollars at work

[Julia]

I'd be interested to hear members' thoughts on this:

Three people sharing a caravan in a caravan park.
A woman in her 50's and her boyfriend, also in his 50's, both receiving a Disability Pension
The woman's son, 30, also receiving a Disability Pension, plus a Carer's Allowance for looking after his mother. He has schizophrenia.

Total fortnightly income for this household is $1800.

They use this almost entirely for internet gambling and then request access to food vouchers from a charity to provide their food.

 

[alanding]

worse in NT.
Lots of people are jobless and get money from centrelink. Then buy drink, get drunk.

 

[resourcesman]

.........i hope they don't breed

 

[toothfairy]

.........i hope they don't breed

Good politicians and goverment will invest wisely in better and more accessible EDUCATION for all which we don't have @ the moment. Cutting back in $ spent in Universities and demanding more & more fees paying students by the Liberal goverment does not help! It is a long sighted view and investment which Johnny needs new spectacles to deal with. Or a change of government.

 

[trinity]

i hope they don't breed

I'm with you on this one, resources man. I feel bad knowing that some people are just wasting tax payers hard earned money on gambling, alcohol, drugs, just because they are lazy.

But what exactly is their disability? Gambling addiction?

OK, what are the statistics on this? How many police can you employ to check up on these sorts of people? Apologies, I do not know how centrelink works, I assume the pension gets paid automatically to the pensioners bank account. Maybe they should just get rent vouchers, utilities vouchers. Well, this is probably an admin headache, compared to just throwing money at them.

 

[Julia]

I'm with you on this one, resources man. I feel bad knowing that some people are just wasting tax payers hard earned money on gambling, alcohol, drugs, just because they are lazy.

But what exactly is their disability? Gambling addiction?

OK, what are the statistics on this? How many police can you employ to check up on these sorts of people? Apologies, I do not know how centrelink works, I assume the pension gets paid automatically to the pensioners bank account. Maybe they should just get rent vouchers, utilities vouchers. Well, this is probably an admin headache, compared to just throwing money at them.

Trinity, your suggestion of vouchers is really sensible. Trouble is, there would be a huge outcry from the civil libertarians that governments were removing people's right of choice etc etc.

Yes, their pension does get paid into their bank accounts, and the whole fortnightly amount is sometimes gone in the first few days.

And yes, policing abuse of the funds would be next to impossible.
A brave government would adopt the idea of rent being paid to landlord, pro rata fortnightly amount to the electricity supplier etc before the pensioner can access what is left.

 

[son of baglimit]

a lot of people have all their bills paid fortnightly, deliberately paid by the pension providers to allow the recipients to understand how much they have left to spend at their leisure......regretably centrelink arent one of those providers, and this method has to be requested by recipient.

 

[theasxgorilla]

I'd be interested to hear members' thoughts on this:

Three people sharing a caravan in a caravan park.
A woman in her 50's and her boyfriend, also in his 50's, both receiving a Disability Pension
The woman's son, 30, also receiving a Disability Pension, plus a Carer's Allowance for looking after his mother. He has schizophrenia.

Total fortnightly income for this household is $1800.

They use this almost entirely for internet gambling and then request access to food vouchers from a charity to provide their food.

Good case for the 'Australian' Smartcard. Join the systems that need to be joined so these people get the assistance (not the handouts) they need.

 

[visual]

Julia,
I`m not familiar with the American way of doing things,but from what I understand they can only stay on welfare for a certain amount of time and then they have to get a job,but from watching Judge Judy you get the impression that there`s lots of layers to their system ,which in the end leads to the same rorts that we see here.Again that is what I`ve learned through TV so probably not very accurate,but at the end of the day when you make money available to people who don`t have to work for it,it always seems to become too much of an attraction not to abuse.

Vouchers seem like a good idea though,they`re used for schools and such but again only for half of the amount,so kids still don`t get their uniforms or books which is what that half is meant to be kept aside for.

 

[BradK]

Damnit... looks like I'll be the bleeding heart leftie here....

Although people who frequent share forums have the get up and go to achieve or at least aim for financial independence, not everyone is wired that way.

Often, these lives are lived out because daddy and grandaddy did it too. I know, my daddy and grandaddy lived the kinds of lives you are talking about.

I got out, and was co-opted into the 'pull yourself up by the bootstraps' school, and I have done quite well. However, I remain convinced that governments should help people whose lot in life is worse than ourselves.

And lets face it... $1800 bucks per fortnight is peanuts for these people in hte context of our resources boom and the budget for fighting the war on terror.

Shall we kick them while they are down? Try living on the aged pension and rent privately and the sad news is ... they are already being kicked! WAY below the poverty line.

We are a lucky country. Lucky enough for some people to surf/gamble all day courtesy of the government and our tax payer funded dole. Good on them, I say! Drop out if you can - because they are NOT financially being rewarded for it.

Cheers
Brad

 

[visual]

Bradk,
these are not choices to be made willingly,these are our dollars they are choosing to waste,by your reckoning I should then have the right not to pay taxes so these choosers don`t get to choose to waste my money

 

[BradK]

Bradk,
these are not choices to be made willingly,these are our dollars they are choosing to waste,by your reckoning I should then have the right not to pay taxes so these choosers don`t get to choose to waste my money

I have worked with these people... and I can tell you, its like banging your head against a brick wall to knock some financial sense into them. I am not being cynical, but just see that often these are the ones that are good targets to kick yet we dont question how other money is spent by the government.

My point is... these are the least of our worries. We are ALREADY punishing them by forcing them to live WAY BELOW THE POVERTY LINE.

If they want to surf... let is all I say

Cheers
Brad

 

[Buster]

Hey Brad,

My point is... these are the least of our worries. We are ALREADY punishing them by forcing them to live WAY BELOW THE POVERTY LINE.

$900 a week below the poverty line???? I thought the average wage at the moment was about $50k... and then the earners have to pay tax for the 'freeloaders' that choose to be parasites who get these handouts (and don't pay tax!!)

Get's my goat.. but you are right, there are a lot of other areas the government fails to spend our taxpayer dollars wisely also..

Regards,

Buster

 

[visual]

I have worked with these people... and I can tell you, its like banging your head against a brick wall to knock some financial sense into them. I am not being cynical, but just see that often these are the ones that are good targets to kick yet we dont question how other money is spent by the government.

My point is... these are the least of our worries. We are ALREADY punishing them by forcing them to live WAY BELOW THE POVERTY LINE.

If they want to surf... let is all I say

Cheers
Brad

Brad,
do you reckon that if welfare was harder to get,they`d still be so hard to knock some sense into?

As for other government waste,agree,but still ,
I live two doors down from someone who has been on welfare for twenty five years.Recently had his house totally done over,thanks to the government,talking to him,we suggested that maybe now was the time to actually buy the house from the government,he was appalled ,he reckons that he didn`t pay for any of the maintenance,painting,replacement of hot water tank,concrete re done,didn`t look like there was much wrong with the concrete,but anyway,carpets replacement..his point was that he never even pays for the light globes ,so why would he want to buy the house for?

By the way he has no problems working cash in hand,full time.
There`s no way he would be able to fill the recycling bin with beer bottles otherwise,

That`s what really annoys me about these abuses.


Having said that, I actually have no problem with people getting a hand up,but it`s these sorts of abuses that I wish were harder to ......anyway,can`t think of the word.

Good night

 

[yonnie]

Hey Brad,



$900 a week below the poverty line???? I thought the average wage at the moment was about $50k...Regards,
Buster

Buster, Julia said $1800 per fortnight for the 3 of them, so thats $300 each per week.

And thats because they`re on a disability pension/carers benefit.

I would`ve thought that its their business how to spend their money, although its sad ofcourse.

Remember we`re not born/made equally

Just be happy that you have a better future than always living in despair.

 

[Buster]

Hey Vet,

Buster, Julia said $1800 per fortnight for the 3 of them, so thats $300 each per week. And thats because they`re on a disability pension/carers benefit..

Ahh, Yep, you're right.. still factor in the rental assistance, food vouchers etc etc.. they seem to be doing alright. Anyone that can afford to fritter $900 a week gambling is doing it pretty easy I'd say..

I would`ve thought that its their business how to spend their money, although its sad ofcourse..

I think you're missing the point.. it's not thier money, it's ours that has been given to them to fullfill thier basic requirements of existing.. food, washing powder etc.. not for gambling!!

Remember we`re not born/made equally

Yeah, shame that.. I'd probably have more drinking buddies if that were the case..

Just be happy that you have a better future than always living in despair.

Oh, I'm more than happy with my lot in life, just can't help thinking how much better the "better" future could be if my tax dollars were not being squandered on someones booze, smokes and gambling fund..

I'm with Visual, apply the rules more stringently and you might find these type of people may have an attitute change.. we might even reduce the numbers on welfare if it's less hassle to get a job than apply for welfare..

Here's an idea, instead of allowing them (general 'them' not those discussed in this thread) to sleep in every morning, laze around the house etc etc make then responsible to arrive at a particular location and do 'something' for the normal working day in order to recieve thier welfare money.. dunno perhaps we could split them into two groups, one group to make cane baskets, and one group to pull them apart again.. I'm tipping if they actaully had to 'do' something, many may just go out and get a job.. who knows..

Vis, I'd have no qualms about reporting the 'rorter' that you described.. even if only 10% were picked up and charged we would have swags of extra 'revenue' to.. errr.. squander elsewhere..

my

Regards,

Buster

 

[visual]

Buster,
have you ever tried to do just that!
The system is geared to protecting these people,after all if only genueni people could access these funds most of the do gooders would actually find themselves out of a job and God forbid would have to put a good day`s worth of work themselves.

I actually tried to do that to someone else,who worked with my husband,he showed off about how well he was doing on the pension,so upon ringing up I found myself being given the thrid degree about why I would want to dob this guy in!!!!!!My point was that he had no problems lifting heavy parcels all on his own but would then get his cane out when he was finished in case he was being watched presumably,anyway nothing ever came of that,and he got to live a good life at our expense,beach house,brand new house ,new car,I mean how does that not sets off alarm bells,

By the way he actually showed off that the money he was earning cash in hand was great ,really couldn`t understand why more people were`nt claiming benefits like he was.He was working every day and basically full time,most of the work he did at home though.

 

[Wysiwyg]

.........i hope they don't breed

The dysfunctionals breed more than the good people.It is a source of income and they have nothing else to do but lay around and f### all day.

 

[insider]

Shouldn't there be a system where you have to hold onto all the receipts to prove that you are spending the money wisely? I can imagine something like this taking up a lot of of precious government workers time so maybe apply this rule to house holds and families that claim more than two pensions... Just a thought...

 

[insider]

I'd be interested to hear members' thoughts on this:

Three people sharing a caravan in a caravan park.
A woman in her 50's and her boyfriend, also in his 50's, both receiving a Disability Pension
The woman's son, 30, also receiving a Disability Pension, plus a Carer's Allowance for looking after his mother. He has schizophrenia.

Total fortnightly income for this household is $1800.

They use this almost entirely for internet gambling and then request access to food vouchers from a charity to provide their food.

Julia... smash me in the head with a hammer so that I can become mentally disabled... then we can join our disability pensions together and live like royalty...