BKI - BKI Investment Company

[divs4ever]

yes $1.47 would have me reaching for the calculator

 

[Belli]

From what I recall the management of BKI present themselves in a similar light and attitude towards investing as other older LICs.

It does not appear they have been very successful at it. It'd be a total avoid if I had funds to invest outside of my present holdings.

 

[divs4ever]

sometimes boring and conventional thinking is good

BKI is not a big part of my portfolio , but in a risky market sometimes a steady hand is a nice insurance

much depends on WHY BKI falls , if it is in tandem with the market , well that is fine by me , i will probably add more ,
if BKI was falling because of bad investment choices , that is a very different problem ( very easy to be lured into a dud IPO , plenty of big managers have done that )

to me div. yield ( at my buying prices ) is important to me , i can always 'average down' my price in a falling market as long as management isn't starting to unravel

besides i hold other LICs better at small-caps/mid-caps and shorter holding times ( WIC and WAX as examples) sure the yields are higher but they take extra risks and are always more likely to stand on a bear-trap

 

[Belli]

That is about as brilliant a strategy as averaging down into AGL.

 

[So_Cynical]

From what I recall the management of BKI present themselves in a similar light and attitude towards investing as other older LICs.

It does not appear they have been very successful at it.

Was looking at BKI and other LIC's and ETF's the other day, BKI is/was a
standout underperformer. shareholders voting with their feet - leaving.

 

[mullokintyre]

That is about as brilliant a strategy as averaging down into AGL.

View attachment 131077

Beli I think you may have missed the point of what Div was saying.
Everybody has different investment rationals, some reasonable, some not so.
But the one thing you can say, is what is a good investment strategy for person A, is not so much for person B.
In my SMSF, the members are at various stages of their working/retirement life, and thus have different risk levels, tax levels, time frame levels and investment ethic levels.
Income streams are of vital importance to those who are in pension phase and have no other income.
They are of little consequence to someone working at getting their income from their work.
I invest in some higher risk/higher reward trading options for those very early on in accumulation phase., and safer income producing streams for the more elderly members.
BKI would fit that bill if i can get it a low enough price, and would keep averaging down provided I was confident enough it would still keep producing the income stream, as that is what is the most important.
Mick

 

[Craton]

Have held BKI since the IPO. One thing to note is managements investment model.

BKI is focused on investing in quality companies for the long-term that have a history of and are expected to continue to pay attractive and growing dividends.

I'm thinking that with many of BKI holdings recently paying a reduced or nil divvy, impacts to the negative.

 

[Craton]

Further, was/am looking at the longer term and BKI gets me access to companies I don't want to directly hold, TLS e.g.

 

[So_Cynical]

Further, was/am looking at the longer term and BKI gets me access to companies I don't want to directly hold, TLS e.g.

Yeah but many LIC's and ETF's will give an investor access to the top 20, the AFI SP has smashed BKI as
has pretty much every other large broad based LIC and ETF, AFI prob has a higher div yield as well?
~

 

[Ferret]

I inherited some BKI a few years back and sold out about 18 months ago.

I looked carefully at it and the results just didn't stack up against the bigger LICs like AFI, which I have as a core holding.

The senior Milner seems to be quite astute. SOL has performed much better than the son's BKI.

 

[Belli]

Yeah but many LIC's and ETF's will give an investor access to the top 20, the AFI SP has smashed BKI as
has pretty much every other large broad based LIC and ETF, AFI prob has a higher div yield as well?

For sure it is each to their own but if going for an LIC, there may be better ones than BKI. 17 September report.

LIC reports and updates

Various reports and updates on Listed Investment Companies (LICs) and Listed Managed Investments (LMIs) as provided by Bell Potter, Independent Investment Research, and Morningstar.

www.firstlinks.com.au

 

[So_Cynical]

I inherited some BKI a few years back and sold out about 18 months ago.

I looked carefully at it and the results just didn't stack up against the bigger LICs like AFI, which I have as a core holding.

The senior Milner seems to be quite astute. SOL has performed much better than the son's BKI.

Just looking at their august monthly report, BKI has 18000 shareholders, and have 2.6% of the fund in Telstra.

https://bkilimited.com.au/investment/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/NTA-Aug2021.pdf

 

[divs4ever]

but

Yeah but many LIC's and ETF's will give an investor access to the top 20, the AFI SP has smashed BKI as
has pretty much every other large broad based LIC and ETF, AFI prob has a higher div yield as well?
~
View attachment 131079

so far , i haven't been desperate to access the Top 20 , i snapped up BKI at a fair valuation and a reasonable mandate , but in the next big dip AFI , or maybe ARG , or AUI could be better value than BKI

the beauty of LICs ( to me ) they give interesting variations to the basic theme of tracking ( out-performing ) the index but the opportunity to buy at a discount to the NTA .

ETFs have their place , but they only try to track an index hoping inflation will do the heavy lifting ( and to me that is fine if buying insurance )

 

[divs4ever]

thanks for the report update

where i differ from many , is i do not put all my effort into one LIC , ETF or stock ( i don't expect one investment to be a winner all the time , most will have both good times and bad )

you can probably class WES , SOL and GOW as investment companies ( i hold all three )

LICs i currently hold are BKI , CAM , CDM , D2O , EAI , IBC , PIA , PL8 , QVE , WAX , WIC , WLS

 

[Belli]

ETFs have their place , but they only try to track an index hoping inflation will do the heavy lifting ( and to me that is fine if buying insurance )

That would have to be the most inane statements I have read in many a year.

If what you claim is true then the only reason the S&P/ASX 300 Index can increase (which is what a product such as VAS tracks) is due to inflation only. Your understanding of index funds is clearly zero.

As for the LICs you hold you are paying a motza in fees for the underperformance net of dividends of the majority of them. GOW, by the way, is technically classified as an LIC. There are certain criteria which apply for companies to be able to be listed as such and GOW meets those.

Your thoughts are naught but an empty shell. I'll save myself any future effort by ignoring the drivel you post.

 

[divs4ever]

i understand VAS well enough to understand it rents out customers shares to short-sellers AND uses my voting power in those shares to enforce an ESG ( and carbon neutral )agenda whether i align with those views or not

and therefore my holdings in Vanguard and Blackrock ETFs are up for sale ( at a price ) and will be replaced by comparable ETFs when the opportunity presents ( probably during a market meltdown )

and by the way you always had the option to ignore me or debate me

cheers

 

[divs4ever]

but lets compare the XKO ( Top 300 ) from the low in 2011 ( somewhere close to) 4003 points and the current closing price of 7246 points a 81% rise over roughly ten years

PLEASE NOTE the constituents of the XKO in 2011 differ quite a bit from the constituents today ( October 2021 )

my VAS av. of $57.48 ( my cheapest parcel was $52.70 bought December 2011 ) and the current closing price of $92.77 a 76% rise over my lowest price but since i didn't buy at the 2011 bottom that 81% above is probably closer to the VAS performance

anyone want a stab at guessing the REAL inflation ( per annum ) over the last ten years how close to 8% per annum was it ( compared to 'official inflation ' ) i am guessing real inflation has averaged over 5% per annum which would imply VAS has only managed a 3% per annum capital gain over real inflation despite the constituent changes ( and capital gains/losses )

now VAS as an insurance against me picking badly it has done it's job nicely sadly management has made some decisions i dislike but i can't blame the computer algorithm for that ( it is a typical key person risk in a managed fund )

Per Share Statistics​

TYPE	2011	2012	2014	2015	2016	2017	2018	2019	2020	2021	TREND
Distributions (c)	241.10	254.10	299.10	296.30	292.40	294.10	337.20	356.50	267.10	0.00
Franking (%)	69.00	76.00	71.00	82.00	71.00	75.00	66.00	81.00	72.00	--

DYOR

 

[Belli]

In the event some new investor reads this understand, contrary to the view of one uninformed and crazy poster, with index funds there is no key person risk. Plain vanilla ETFs are not actively managed funds.

Appreciate that indexing is a form of passive fund management. Instead of a fund portfolio manager actively stock picking and market timing the fund manager builds a portfolio whose holdings mirror the securities of a particular index. There is no human involvement in the price of the ETF.

Authorised participants involved in the creation of an ETF is an organisation that has the right to create and redeem shares of an ETF. They provide a large portion of the liqudity in the ETF market by obtaining the underlying assets required to create the shares of an ETF. When there is a shortage of ETF shares in the market, authorized participants create more. Conversely, authorized participants will reduce ETF shares in circulation when the price of the ETF is lower than the price of the underlying shares. That can be done with the creation and redemption mechanism that keeps the price of an ETF aligned with its underlying net asset value.

 

[divs4ever]

i would suggest the unfortunate demise of Jack Bogle was exactly that

Jack Bogle Investment Advice – His Top 10 Philosophies​

Jack Bogle Investment Advice - 10 Rules He Always Follows

Want to learn how to invest like Vanguard founder, Jack Bogle? Check out the 10 pieces of Jack Bogle investment advice he swears by.

wealthpursuits.com

after his demise
Vanguard started ( openly ) lending shares , and decided to to pressure some companies to change their business model ( leveraging the 5% plus holdings in large cap. companies )

now i am not going to tell you i followed his every rule ( i didn't ) but i could respect his approach well enough to buy VAS and VHY in 2011 when there were plenty of cheap stocks to buy competing for the same cash

cheers

 

[divs4ever]

with a LIC you are buying into a management team and ( normally ) a fairly strict mandate and strategy


but an ETF should be all about 'the magic algorithm ' and index chosen to track