Will China end up owning the World?

[sptrawler]

This is an interesting article IMO, especially the part about excluding Chinese banks from the U.S dollar system, would that mean that the Chinese currency is floated by default.
Interesting concept, maybe each country would have to value the Yuan against their own currency, now that would be interesting.
By doing that would it in effect be a surrogate tariff system, certainly is interesting times.
Obviously this has a long way to play out yet, there is a lot of white noise going on IMO, Trump certainly isn't going quietly.
Just my thoughts.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...ment-ban-aims-to-cement-tough-on-china-legacy
From the article:
He has already issued one executive order banning US investment in companies owned or controlled by the Chinese military. On Monday, 89 companies were added to the list. David Dollar, senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, said the order was largely symbolic, but Trump could take other “highly risky” measures that “a responsible policy-maker would not even consider”, such as cutting off big Chinese banks from the US dollar system .

 

[satanoperca]

This is an interesting article IMO, especially the part about excluding Chinese banks from the U.S dollar system, would that mean that the Chinese currency is floated by default.
Interesting concept, maybe each country would have to value the Yuan against their own currency, now that would be interesting.
By doing that would it in effect be a surrogate tariff system, certainly is interesting times.
Obviously this has a long way to play out yet, there is a lot of white noise going on IMO, Trump certainly isn't going quietly.
Just my thoughts.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...ment-ban-aims-to-cement-tough-on-china-legacy
From the article:
He has already issued one executive order banning US investment in companies owned or controlled by the Chinese military. On Monday, 89 companies were added to the list. David Dollar, senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, said the order was largely symbolic, but Trump could take other “highly risky” measures that “a responsible policy-maker would not even consider”, such as cutting off big Chinese banks from the US dollar system .

I have never understood this. China wants to be seen as a world economic leader on one hand, on the other a third world country. They peg their dollar to the $US.

Well China, if you want to play internationally, the Yuan should be free floating against all other currencies, and then see if you can compete.

Them picking fights with other countries will be to their detrement.

 

[sptrawler]

I have never understood this. China wants to be seen as a world economic leader on one hand, on the other a third world country. They peg their dollar to the $US.

Well China, if you want to play internationally, the Yuan should be free floating against all other currencies, and then see if you can compete.

Them picking fights with other countries will be to their detrement.

That may prove very true, as we have said on here previously, the outsourcing of manufacturing to third world countries was intended to lift them out of poverty, not to enable them to own the world.
We seem to have hit the critical point in time, where the question requires an answer, it will be interesting to see how Biden addresses it, China has already shown its intent IMO.
Now China has placed tariffs on Australia, it has exposed the multinationals to having to make a decision, 'if they really belong to a country', because China can't complain when tariffs are now imposed on their products which in turn affects the multi nationals bottom line.
Do they support China in the name of profits, or do they relocate some of their manufacturing to other countries, to protect their living standards and assist other poorer countries?
This corona virus has brought about a lot of soul searching and priority analysis, amazing times we live in.
Trump started the ball rolling on China and the multi nationals, but China has given it a lot more momentum IMO.
Just my thoughts.

 

[basilio]

Trumps efforts to isolate China economically can be countered by China developing its own digital currency which is usd internally as well as for payment internationally. This is a significant work in progress and would enable China to decouple from the US dollar andperhaps create a rival international currency.

China leads in race for digital currency – DW – 10/05/2020

China's central bank has made steady advances in its goal of launching the world's first major sovereign digital currency. As the EU begins prepping a digital euro, DW considers the impact of the digital yuan.

www.dw.com

 

[satanoperca]

Trumps efforts to isolate China economically can be countered by China developing its own digital currency which is usd internally as well as for payment internationally. This is a significant work in progress and would enable China to decouple from the US dollar andperhaps create a rival international currency.

China leads in race for digital currency – DW – 10/05/2020

China's central bank has made steady advances in its goal of launching the world's first major sovereign digital currency. As the EU begins prepping a digital euro, DW considers the impact of the digital yuan.

www.dw.com

Wouldn't that in essence be the same as floating their dollar?

 

[sptrawler]

Trumps efforts to isolate China economically can be countered by China developing its own digital currency which is usd internally as well as for payment internationally. This is a significant work in progress and would enable China to decouple from the US dollar andperhaps create a rival international currency.

China leads in race for digital currency – DW – 10/05/2020

China's central bank has made steady advances in its goal of launching the world's first major sovereign digital currency. As the EU begins prepping a digital euro, DW considers the impact of the digital yuan.

www.dw.com

Only if Australia or any other country accepts it, IMO for a crypto currency to work, it has to be a universal currency.
Which I think will happen eventually, but all countries have to have confidence in its integrity, this is where bitcoin is failing no one can use it down the shop.
So unless China can get everyone to have confidence in their 'crypto currency' no one will accept it as a form of trade, if they can then it will become the world currency, but i can't see that happening as they have already shot their feet off in the trust department.
Just my opinion.
Trump has actually done a great job of exposing the China/multinationals cartel IMO, the warning flags and sirens are blaring around the world ATM, it hasn't been a clever play by China IMO.

 

[satanoperca]

Only if Australia or any other country accepts it, IMO for a crypto currency to work, it has to be a universal currency.
Which I think will happen eventually, but all countries have to have confidence in its integrity, this is where bitcoin is failing no one can use it down the shop.
So unless China can get everyone to have confidence in their 'crypto currency' no one will accept it as a form of trade, if they can then it will become the world currency, but i can't see that happening as they have already shot their feet off in the trust department.
Just my opinion.

Interesting point - TRUST.

 

[basilio]

China is introducing its digital currency for the Chines community initially. However it will also attempt to use this currency to pay for imports from various trading partners.

We'll see how it pans out but the belief that the US dollar is only way to trade around the world can be challenged.

 

[sptrawler]

China is introducing its digital currency for the Chines community initially. However it will also attempt to use this currency to pay for imports from various trading partners.

We'll see how it pans out but the belief that the US dollar is only way to trade around the world can be challenged.

Of course it can, but the world has to trust that the country of tender will honour its obligations, that is where the issue lies and where some are being found wanting ATM.

 

[sptrawler]

Well at last NATO has woken up, if there has been one thing Trump achieved, it was to highlight the position China is putting the rest of the world in.
Obviously the kick in the nether regions, that Trump gave NATO, had the desired effect and woke them up from their 30 year sleep.
Just my opinion.

NATO boss says China challenge too great for US alone

The move reflects the reality that no single country can combat China on its own, according to NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg.

www.smh.com.au

 

[IFocus]

Well at last NATO has woken up, if there has been one thing Trump achieved, it was to highlight the position China is putting the rest of the world in.
Obviously the kick in the nether regions, that Trump gave NATO, had the desired effect and woke them up from their 30 year sleep.
Just my opinion.

NATO boss says China challenge too great for US alone

The move reflects the reality that no single country can combat China on its own, according to NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg.

www.smh.com.au

NATO was a child of the US to project military power across Europe at Russia.

Europe carried all the risk allowing US troops and bases to be established while the US received the benefit of pressuring the old Soviet Union to spend a large amount of its GDP on its defences and securing the countries around it.

As a result Russia had to limit its interferences in US interests around the globe.

Win win for the US.

Clearly there were benefits military for Europe as well but it certainly wasn't one sided as the BS propagated by Trump.

Great powers project economic power followed by military power which is what the US did after WW2.

That's what China is now doing sound familar?

This is while Trump went with the US 1st policy withdrawing from agreements that projected US economic power while using military power as insurance.

By any measure as 70 million Americans voted for this I think its the end of the great US empire and its influence.

Given the mug punter responses lately of the Australian government to China's baiting we will be speaking Chinese soon.

 

[sptrawler]

Given the mug punter responses lately of the Australian government to China's baiting we will be speaking Chinese soon.

Yes, they could "Rat F@@k us" yet.

 

[SirRumpole]

* tear up the China-Australia FTA, it's obviously useless

* charge a tariff on all Chinese goods at the maximum rate that they charge our goods.

* if they ban one of our exporters, ban one of theirs.

* indefinitely suspend all further Chinese investment in Australia.

* put a levy on all iron ore exports to China and invest this in industries that could replace Chinese imports

* put quality standards on all goods and minutely inspect all goods of Chinese origin arriving here for quality standards.

* mandate Australian steel in all publicly funded infrastructure.

* stop treating universities as atms for overseas students and prioritise local students.

* ban WeChat and other foreign propaganda outfits from Australia

* reduce the number of Chines diplomats in Australia to the bare minimum.

Will the government do any of this ?

no, because they are gutless.

 

[sptrawler]

@SirRumpole would any government do it, no because they are all the same.

Would the general public put up with the loss of of cheap Chinese products? No because they love cheap $hit.

Would the multinationals accept tariffs on their products manufactured by cheap labour? No as Trump found out.

Would the media back the Government? No, as Trump found out.

 

[SirRumpole]

@SirRumpole would any government do it, no because they are all the same.

Would the general public put up with the loss of of cheap Chinese products? No because they love cheap $hit.

Would the multinationals accept tariffs on their products manufactured by cheap labour? No as Trump found out.

Would the media back the Government? No, as Trump found out.

So we just suck up China's crap and bendover for more ?

As I said, gutless.

 

[sptrawler]

So we just suck up China's crap and bendover for more ?

As I said, gutless.

It would appear that Morrison is already copping it, for the stance he has taken already.
But I'm with you, we are better taking short term pain for long term gain, but I'm sure we would be in the minority.
I can't see many being happy to pay a premium for Australian product, just because it will give Aussie's jobs, if that was the case Holden, Ford, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Sidchrome, the Albany wool mills, Meters white goods, AWA televisions would still be made here.
The older generation will soon be gone and the new norm will be way of the day.

 

[SirRumpole]

It would appear that Morrison is already copping it, for the stance he has taken already.
But I'm with you, we are better taking short term pain for long term gain, but I'm sure we would be in the minority.
I can't see many being happy to pay a premium for Australian product, just because it will give Aussie's jobs, if that was the case Holden, Ford, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Sidchrome, the Albany wool mills, Meters white goods, AWA televisions would still be made here.
The older generation will soon be gone and the new norm will be way of the day.

We can get cheap but higher quality goods from places like South Korea, Japan and Taiwan(which would really rile China).

We import a lot of food from China, which beats me when people keep saying we can produce enough to feed 75 million.

 

[sptrawler]

We can get cheap but higher quality goods from places like South Korea, Japan and Taiwan(which would really rile China).

We import a lot of food from China, which beats me when people keep saying we can produce enough to feed 75 million.

My guess is alternative supply chains will already be investigated, a friend who is involved in an electronics related company was saying, they are looking to source their cct boards from alternative suppliers.
The problem is most advanced countries manufacturers have outsourced production to China, it is still happening, Merc, Tesla etc are building factories there because they want to sell there and build there, so sourcing from elsewhere is problematic.
With food, we probably export the produce to China, they process it, tin it and send it back, we used to have cannaries but they were relocated to Asia when tariffs were taken off.

https://www.pc.gov.au/inquiries/completed/tomato-safeguards/submissions/submissions-test/submission-counter/sub018-tomato-safeguards.pdf

 

[sptrawler]

China keeps tightening the screws, it must make Daniel Andrews sweat over the belt and road deal, it would appear China is a great friend until you upset them.

China blocks more Australian timber exports amid pressure to take dispute to WTO

China's attack on Australian trade continues, with timber exports from two more states blocked and the number of meatworks waiting to resume trade growing to eight.

www.abc.net.au

From the article:
China's attack on Australian trade is continuing, with timber exports from two more states blocked and the number of meatworks waiting to resume trade growing to eight.
An official notice from China's Customs authority, issued earlier this month, notified Australian exporters that a pest had been detected in shipments of logs from South Australia and Tasmania, but did not specify what type.

 

[dutchie]

Australia is selling "the farm" for a Banquet today.

When the Banquet is finished, we are left with nothing.