The ScoMo Government

[sptrawler]

I definitely agree that confidence is the key and more rate cuts won't work.

If governments wanted to invest infrastructure and create jobs then near zero interest rates are the time to do it. Infrastructure will be needed at some time (it is needed right now), so if they have to borrow at 5% in some years they are just stupid if they don't do it now.

It will be interesting to see which projects get up and running first, as that will be reflected in the share prices of the associated industries.IMO

 

[wayneL]

Economists give thumbs down to government's economic strategy.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11...p-lowe-not-treasurer-josh-frydenberg/11667836

I'll bet they are all Keynesian swill.

Not that I especially support the government's economic policy though.

 

[macca]

I think that should the Gov decide to build some major infrastructure now would be an excellent time to do so. With the huge reduction in mining start ups there must be heaps of equipment and trained people lying idle.

Issue some Gov Bonds at 2% and get as much as you need, give Oz residents and trusts first bite at the cherry and no AUD problems.

Retirees could/would spend a little more as they adjust their expenditure to their income and jobs would be created both in the building and the spending.

I believe we should do it as long as it is something that will still be useful 50 years from now.

 

[sptrawler]

I think that should the Gov decide to build some major infrastructure now would be an excellent time to do so. With the huge reduction in mining start ups there must be heaps of equipment and trained people lying idle.

Issue some Gov Bonds at 2% and get as much as you need, give Oz residents and trusts first bite at the cherry and no AUD problems.

Retirees could/would spend a little more as they adjust their expenditure to their income and jobs would be created both in the building and the spending.

I believe we should do it as long as it is something that will still be useful 50 years from now.

Agree with you completely Macca, there is no point in just throwing money out the window, well thought out infrastructure is required to increase our productivity.
I hope the engineering and design work, on Snowy 2.0 and the Tassie battery, is well advanced and can be commenced soon. That would give the green light for a lot more wind and solar to be installed.
Also Keatings idea of a high speed train from Sydney to Newcastle, seems to have merit, as it should take pressure of the Sydney housing market.
The Government bonds are a great idea, it would give retirees another option for parking savings.

 

[Humid]

https://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs...79EACA2718D0318ACA2581AF001493AA?OpenDocument

Tax cut working a treat

 

[sptrawler]

Apparently there are a lot suggesting, more tax cuts should be brought forward, sounds like a better idea than throwing money out the window.IMO
After all a tax cut, in reality, is just a pay rise in another form. It still goes back into the economy and the Government gets their cut back.
https://www.theage.com.au/politics/...st-banks-urge-government-20191106-p537w4.html

 

[PZ99]

Tax reform is the ultimate panacea for a stagnant economy in my view even if it does take time to filter down. (Which is why you do it in more buoyant times)

I'd like to see the Govt do a deal with the states on anachronisms like payroll tax for starters

 

[IFocus]

Tax reform is badly needed but killed up by both sides now, tax cuts given this year were unfunded plus throwing money at the top end has little return.

 

[sptrawler]

Tax reform is badly needed but killed up by both sides now, tax cuts given this year were unfunded plus throwing money at the top end has little return.

Throwing money anywhere has little return, unless it improves the underlying productivity.
Otherwise it is just taking money out of the economy, to prop up what is already a problem, no one who has worked to get ahead would think of it as a good plan.
One could throw up many analogies in the home budget, where a family member keeps coming back saying all I need is more money, when in reality all the extra money is doing is supporting poor life choices.

 

[Knobby22]

Throwing money anywhere has little return, unless it improves the underlying productivity.
Otherwise it is just taking money out of the economy, to prop up what is already a problem, no one who has worked to get ahead would think of it as a good plan.
One could throw up many analogies in the home budget, where a family member keeps coming back saying all I need is more money, when in reality all the extra money is doing is supporting poor life choices.

Hey, a decent tax cut would let me join the local golf club. That's not a poor life choice!

 

[sptrawler]

Hey, a decent tax cut would let me join the local golf club. That's not a poor life choice!

Lucky you, with two replaced knees a replaced hip and severe arthritis of my right wrist, the only times I go to the golf club is to catch up with the ex workmates at the 19th hole.

 

[SirRumpole]

Lucky you, with two replaced knees a replaced hip and severe arthritis of my right wrist, the only times I go to the golf club is to catch up with the ex workmates at the 19th hole.

Hire an electric golf cart.

 

[sptrawler]

Hire an electric golf cart.

Actually a lot of the guys do, but if I have time on my hands, I prefer to walk around the 18 and take the pizz out of them.
I think it is great, that they all get together once a month and hold the whole golf club up, as they thrash their way through the bush.
Also you get a lot of different opinions on issues.lol

 

[basilio]

Government decided a few days ago that Robo Debt could be dodgy. (Just before a court case is coming up...)

As usual First Dog on the Moon summed it up.
Robodebt's methods are not just deliberately cruel - they may be against the law

First Dog on the Moon Robodebt was designed to work badly, and it did its job with ruthless inefficiency
https://www.theguardian.com/comment...eliberately-cruel-they-may-be-against-the-law

 

[orr]

TheRobo cluster-fuk

Will Tudge's head be on the block for this ghastly epoch of Politically expedient dog whistling inhumanity? Doubt it.
The self-righteous God bothering, holier than thou, Bible thumping ruling clique that pull his strings knows that god helps those that help themselves.
How many suicides can be directly sheeted home to this?... Quite a few more than the conservatives love nothing more than to remind people of the Rudd 'insulation roll out'...

And a dubious legal area... I'll pray for a class action. Should line up well with the next election.
P.S
Sky After dark is Sewage.

 

[Smurf1976]

I've read a report of some comments over the past couple of days from two former PM's, John Howard and Malcolm Turnbull, both saying basically the same thing.

The parliament, both major parties, has become unrepresentative the people they are supposed to be representing.

In short too many with either no background at all in non-political work or if they have then it's mostly lawyers and a few teachers. Take those out and there'd be pretty much nobody left in either of the two major parties.

Very true in my view. As Turnbull pointed out, Labor used to have a lot more people who had a union background but that background was tradesmen on the tools not uni students who got a job working for a union and then went into politics. Likewise the Liberals also had a much broader background in the past, it wasn't all career politicians and lawyers.

Now I've nothing against lawyers or union officials as such, my point being that having the parliament full of people all from the same background is by its very nature not a good situation to have. There needs to be a balance. We don't want it full of engineers, doctors or bricklayers either but a mix of people from a wide range of different backgrounds would be highly desirable. A range of people - a few career politicians and former lawyers yes but also a few from backgrounds in other professions, trades (on the tools), small business, essential services, military or emergency services, big business, public service and so on would vastly improve the thought processes and outcomes.

 

[SirRumpole]

Now I've nothing against lawyers or union officials as such, my point being that having the parliament full of people all from the same background is by its very nature not a good situation to have. There needs to be a balance. We don't want it full of engineers, doctors or bricklayers either but a mix of people from a wide range of different backgrounds would be highly desirable. A range of people - a few career politicians and former lawyers yes but also a few from backgrounds in other professions, trades (on the tools), small business, essential services, military or emergency services, big business, public service and so on would vastly improve the thought processes and outcomes.

Their seems to be a quota for women, I wonder if their are any scientists at all on any side. Maybe we need a quota of scientists.

Someone who has been taught critical thinking and evidence based policy making instead of ideological mores like "have a go to get a go" or similar trash.

As an incidental, I don't often agree with One Nation, but they may have a point here.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11...as-conservatives-fear-leftist-agenda/11648892

I bet the private schools are taught a Rightist agenda, so those need looking at too.

 

[Smurf1976]

Someone who has been taught critical thinking and evidence based policy making instead of ideological mores like "have a go to get a go" or similar trash.

Absolutely.

Looking at how lawyers or union officials think, they've got a lot in common in that they spend a lot of time being extremely pedantic and dwelling on the fine details. They're particularly attuned to finding loopholes based upon technicalities.

There's a place for that sort of thinking certainly but there's also a need for the exact opposite.

Farmers, military, essential services, emergency services and tradies all have something in common in that they're of the "don't stuff about just get it done" mentality. That's basically the opposite of the lawyers and unionists with their focus on technicalities and detail.

Now we wouldn't want the parliament full of people like that but there's a need for some of that thinking most certainly.

Take the contentious climate issue for example. Lots of getting bogged down over pedantic details and technicalities and wriggling their way out of it via whatever loophole they can find and so on. Anyone in the group I mentioned would just get it done and if a law needs to change well then change it and so on. Find a way or make one.

There's a need for both of those sorts of thinking but at present it's almost completely one sided. Lots of people to argue on fine details and looking for loopholes but very few with a practical focus on getting things done and with an understanding that passing the laws or signing a contract means the physical work can now start, it doesn't mean it has been completed.

Scientists think differently again and we need those sorts of people too. Same with those who apply science (as distinct from actual scientists). Creative people too also think differently. And so on. My examples aren't comprehensive, I just picked the group most different to who's there now.

A monoculture, group think, echo chamber or whatever other term exists to describe it is something which is always best avoided. Same with investing - some of the most interesting posts on this forum are the ones presenting a view that's opposite to my own.

 

[SirRumpole]

There's a need for both of those sorts of thinking but at present it's almost completely one sided. Lots of people to argue on fine details and looking for loopholes but very few with a practical focus on getting things done and with an understanding that passing the laws or signing a contract means the physical work can now start, it doesn't mean it has been completed.

I think that is where Keating had a head start.

He didn't get everything right but his lack of education meant he didn't concentrate on minutae but he had a grip on the "overarching narrative", something that is sorely absent in today's politicians.

 

[qldfrog]

And i think a few critical thinking would be welcome for anything related to global warming indeed
I know it is a poor consolation but it is slso definitively a problem in western europe as well, union being replaced by leftist teachers, and lawyers