The advantages and disadvantages of living in countries besides Australia

[SirRumpole]

A general thread where people can voice their opinions of where they would prefer to live.

 

[Sdajii]

Such a vague topic! Wow!

One common thing I talk about as an Australian while travelling around and meeting people in various countries is that life would be easier for most Australians in most of the countries I go to than in Australia, and life in Australia would be easier for them than in their home country.

Just as an example, I arrived in Australia a few days ago with a Vietnamese friend (I met her in a park in Vietnam a bit over a year ago and coincidentally we were heading to Australia at the same time, we met in Malaysia during our transfers en route to Melbourne, I'd just come from Bangkok). In Vietnam an Australian with no education can easily get an easy job earning multiples of a typical local and live a very comfortable lifestyle, buy a house (out of reach of most locals) and generally have a more comfortable life than an uneducated person in Australia can for a similar workload. If they want to study for a relevant job, they can do really well.

On the other hand, an uneducated Vietnamese person in Vietnam has a seriously challenging job of staying alive. They work like slaves, generally 6 days per week, to live in conditions most Australians would consider inhuman. If they're able to come to Australia and work, they'll be able to live in an actual residence with multiple rooms, a separate toilet and kitchen, etc. It's worlds better.

The girl from Vietnam was hoping to stay for as long as possible to learn English fluently, return home and get a better wage. I suspected that after a month she'd want to stay. After 2-3 days it seemed she was already feeling that way, and she's one of the better off ones back home (one of the few who was able to save up to come to Australia legitimately and self funded - this is out of the reach of most, who either need to sneak in or marry a local and be sponsored by them).

I couldn't begin to describe the situations in all the countries I've been to of course. Naturally, one common theme is that most people will never be comfortable/willing or even able to live away from their native culture, language, family etc., even if the quality of life is much better elsewhere. There is often a limitation on available types of work. For some people, various things may be more or less attractive (climate, food, economics, future outlook of the country, government type/politics, culture, etc etc).

Very big topic, difficult to put into a nutshell. I've been travelling for the last few years, currently into my 5th. Some countries I'd prefer over Australia (Japan, Thailand, South Korea and others), some I'd prefer Australia over (India, Cambodia, Singapore and others) and some I'd have trouble deciding between. A lot of it comes down to personal preference. I absolutely love some countries I would basically rule out as places to live (Laos comes to mind). Everyone is different and wants different things out of life. For most people the choice basically comes down to being unwilling to leave home or being too scared to step out and properly experience other countries, meaning they'll always stay where they are. I started out deciding to go on a two month holiday to Asia, which I'm now into my 5th year of, and possibly never again staying in Australia for longer than a visit.

 

[Smurf1976]

Most places I've been I could live in. Only real exceptions of places I've been would be Qatar and the USA.

Qatar was interesting and everyone I had any sort of interaction with was friendly and helpful but the cultural differences are just too vast. They're not extreme there by any means compared to some other countries but still too far from my own world view to be able to live there. That said, I wish I'd stayed longer and done a trip into the desert sand dunes etc. That would have been an experience for sure. Maybe someday.

USA for reasons best explained by saying that Americans are so hyped up about their supposed freedom that you get an incredible sense of actual freedom the moment you step over the border into Canada and stop hearing it all. US officials searching the car at the border to enter the country versus Canadian officials just stamping your passport and wishing you a pleasant time says it all really. Every American I met was fine but the whole military / world superpower / carry a gun / big government thing just isn't for me.

 

[sptrawler]

That said, I wish I'd stayed longer and done a trip into the desert sand dunes etc. That would have been an experience for sure. Maybe someday.

Head North through the Flinders Ranges to Birdsville, turn left and head to Dalhousie Springs, turn right head through Finke to Alice Springs then down the Stuart Hwy home.
You will love it, easy trip well signposted, but still a great ten day adventure.
I went to Namibia took a tour to 'the biggest sand dune in the World'.
I'm sure I've been up bigger in Australia. lol

I haven't yet found a place better than Australia, I came here as an eight year old, went back to the U.K forty years later.
Since then I've been to a lot of Asia, some of Europe a bit of Africa, haven't seen anything I would be jumping onto a leaky boat to get to.

Australia is one of the few Countries in the World, where you can become financially comfortable, through effort.
Also you can survive, if you aren't able to work, for whatever reason.
Most Countries don't offer both options, the problem we have, is we don't appreciate how fortunate we are. IMO

 

[bellenuit]

I was born in Ireland and after graduating I lived in Holland (3 years), US (2 years), Germany before the wall came down (3 years) and a damn long time since here in Australia.

The advantages/disadvantages vary depending on what stage in life you were at. I liked the USA and found the lifestyle similar to what I have experienced here in Australia. I was in Boston which is probably the most European of US cities so they tended not to display the same "God Bless America" attitude that Smurf experienced. I absolutely loved Amsterdam and Berlin, but I was young and single then so my lifestyle was very much into what 24 hour round-the-clock cities had to offer. However, once settled down and married with a family you cannot beat Australia. The type of house I could buy in Perth on a modest income was far superior to what my boss in Berlin could afford and about everyone there just lived in flats. Certainly nowhere to bring up kids.

 

[luutzu]

Head North through the Flinders Ranges to Birdsville, turn left and head to Dalhousie Springs, turn right head through Finke to Alice Springs then down the Stuart Hwy home.
You will love it, easy trip well signposted, but still a great ten day adventure.
I went to Namibia took a tour to 'the biggest sand dune in the World'.
I'm sure I've been up bigger in Australia. lol

I haven't yet found a place better than Australia, I came here as an eight year old, went back to the U.K forty years later.
Since then I've been to a lot of Asia, some of Europe a bit of Africa, haven't seen anything I would be jumping onto a leaky boat to get to.

Australia is one of the few Countries in the World, where you can become financially comfortable, through effort.
Also you can survive, if you aren't able to work, for whatever reason.
Most Countries don't offer both options, the problem we have, is we don't appreciate how fortunate we are. IMO

Was in Phuket some years back. Me and the wife rode halfway round the island to see its famous "waterfall". Paid the fees and all that... got up a bit and saw a few trickle. Thought we're still downstream so walk another couple hundred metres and na, that was it, small little stream is not a waterfall man.

Same in Vietnam's famous waterfall in the highlands - Dalat... A couple two metre high steps with water falling down from it and they someho managed to set up an attraction. I think the water was somewhat polluted too, could smell it.

 

[sptrawler]

Was in Phuket some years back. Me and the wife rode halfway round the island to see its famous "waterfall". Paid the fees and all that... got up a bit and saw a few trickle. Thought we're still downstream so walk another couple hundred metres and na, that was it, small little stream is not a waterfall man.

Same in Vietnam's famous waterfall in the highlands - Dalat... A couple two metre high steps with water falling down from it and they someho managed to set up an attraction. I think the water was somewhat polluted too, could smell it.

I don't know about a water fall on Phuket, but Pha Nang Bay is something special, also renting a motor bike and going over the causeway to Krabi was great.
The humidity can be a problem though, when you live in Perth. lol

 

[sptrawler]

One big problem with living in Australia, IMO, is the tall poppy syndrome.
We thrive on taking down anyone who apires to succeed, and embrace those who don't, it is a weird reverse snobbery syndrome IMO.
Take for example recently, the housing market in Sydney and Melbourne, were going gangbusters.
Everyone was complaining young people couldn't get on board, now it is going backwards at 100mph, no one is sympathetic to those who did get onboard.
The same goes with the share market, as young people got a lot of sympathy for their misfortune with not getting the housing gains, the pensioners aren't getting any sympathy for their loses with a falling share market.
I guess compassion is age related, in Australia.
Those who feel they deserve it, as opposed to those, who everyone thinks has had it. lol

That would explain the Royal Commission into aged care, IMO

 

[Bill M]

There are thousands of Aussie expats living in places like Thailand, Indonesia, Vietnam and Cambodia and they all tend to say the same things, here's some of them.
___
I feel free here, hate the nanny state, I couldn't live in Australia anymore.

With my state pension I can afford to have 3 cooked meals a day in a restaurant and all my accommodation needs plus money left over for beer.

The weather is great here, never cold. I'd be freezing my balls off in [insert capital city here] Australia.

I can do whatever I like when I like. If I want a bottle of beer at 6 AM the 7/11 is just across the road. Are you hungry, the food cart is just there. At home I need to drive 10 kms to my nearest McDonalds or wait for the shops to open at 9 am. Here it's 24/7.

Here, everybody is only to happy to serve me. Service is great. They come to the table and ask what you would like and it comes straight out. I've never had to go to a bar and wait in line to get served and get shitty attitude from the bar maid because I made her work.

I get a haircut here for $3.50, back in OZ they want $25 the same work.
___

The one big negative most expats complain about is long term medical insurance overseas. There are age and coverage issues. Everyone needs to plan for a major illness and that isn't cheap. In Australia our public hospitals will take care of all that, no worries.

 

[SirRumpole]

Another advantage of living elsewhere perhaps

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11...of-nowhere-loophole-could-soon-close/10457846

 

[wayneL]

Its about this time if year every year I start thinking of moving to Norway or somewhere cold.

 

[sptrawler]

Another advantage of living elsewhere perhaps

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11...of-nowhere-loophole-could-soon-close/10457846

So would that effect your welfare entitlement, Medicare status etc?

 

[SirRumpole]

So would that effect your welfare entitlement, Medicare status etc?

I imagine it would but if people had enough money to go to all that trouble they probably aren't too worried about welfare.

Getting health care would be a concern though.

 

[Macquack]

Take for example recently, the housing market in Sydney and Melbourne, were going gangbusters.
Everyone was complaining young people couldn't get on board, now it is going backwards at 100mph, no one is sympathetic to those who did get onboard.

I am not at all sympathetic to those that got on board late and paid unreasonably high prices and may get burnt with both decreasing property values and increasing interest rates. It was those people that made it even harder for the sensible ones who came to the conclusion that the market was overvalued and unsustainable and chose not to buy or could not afford to buy anyway.

 

[Sdajii]

There are thousands of Aussie expats living in places like Thailand, Indonesia, Vietnam and Cambodia and they all tend to say the same things, here's some of them.
___
I feel free here, hate the nanny state, I couldn't live in Australia anymore.

With my state pension I can afford to have 3 cooked meals a day in a restaurant and all my accommodation needs plus money left over for beer.

The weather is great here, never cold. I'd be freezing my balls off in [insert capital city here] Australia.

I can do whatever I like when I like. If I want a bottle of beer at 6 AM the 7/11 is just across the road. Are you hungry, the food cart is just there. At home I need to drive 10 kms to my nearest McDonalds or wait for the shops to open at 9 am. Here it's 24/7.

Here, everybody is only to happy to serve me. Service is great. They come to the table and ask what you would like and it comes straight out. I've never had to go to a bar and wait in line to get served and get shitty attitude from the bar maid because I made her work.

I get a haircut here for $3.50, back in OZ they want $25 the same work.
___

The one big negative most expats complain about is long term medical insurance overseas. There are age and coverage issues. Everyone needs to plan for a major illness and that isn't cheap. In Australia our public hospitals will take care of all that, no worries.

I've spent most of the last 5 years in countries like those, and all of that sounds very familiar, and I can relate to some of it myself. I personally don't like the lifestyle most Australian expats choose (I plan to settle in some small town/village rather than in a larger place where the 7/11 with beer is across the road and the waiters bend over backwards to serve a white man, but I can understand why many do love it. After a short while I'd just start feeling like an arrogant wanker (even more than I actually am ) preying on people in less fortunate circumstances. Certainly some of the people on both sides of that deal can benefit though. I usually pay about 80c for a haircut, although the last few have been free (about a week ago in Thailand a friend studying hairdressing wanted to cut it, the previous one I was with a new friend who wanted to drop in on his barber friend when we were in the area and the guy had never cut a white man's hair before and asked if he could, that was in India, there was one in Laos where a woman wanted to go to a salon with me and insisted on paying for me, I assume it was cheap and I paid for the evening's entertainment).

If you don't mind the change of culture, food and familiarity (or if like me, you actually find that appealing), life for an Australian becomes a lot easier and more free outside Australia. Also a heck of a lot more fun!

 

[Ann]

A general thread where people can voice their opinions of where they would prefer to live.

This is a really interesting topic Sir Rumpy, well done for starting it and well done to the very interesting contributors!

 

[SirRumpole]

Thanks Ann, it was actually suggested by Sadjii I think.

Does anyone have any experience in living in the Pacific islands ? Fiji, Tonga, Vanuatu etc. They seem good places to retire to although some of the governments sound a bit dicey.

 

[sptrawler]

I am not at all sympathetic to those that got on board late and paid unreasonably high prices and may get burnt with both decreasing property values and increasing interest rates. It was those people that made it even harder for the sensible ones who came to the conclusion that the market was overvalued and unsustainable and chose not to buy or could not afford to buy anyway.

I agree completely, what I was commenting on, was the constant barrage of media and the bleeding heart club, bemoaning the fact people couldn't buy into the bubble.
I like you, thought why the hell, would you want to buy into it.
But it didn't stop endless moaning in the media including on this forum, and now the bubble has burst, those that were moaning, are now gloating. lol
They are always on the winning side.

With regard living overseas, a mate of mine, is spending ever increasing time in Thailand.
He and his partner have a house and land there, and would like to relocate there, but he is finding the complete transition difficult.
I watch with interest.

 

[Sir Burr]

With regard living overseas, a mate of mine, is spending ever increasing time in Thailand. He and his partner have a house and land there, and would like to relocate there, but he is finding the complete transition difficult. I watch with interest.

I'm in the exact same position. Be interested to know why a complete transition is difficult for them? Is he married to a local?

Implications of being a non-resident is a minefield with how to manage Australian investments. Also, as mentioned above health care is a concern and afaik leaving Oz for 5+ years you lose Medicare.

 

[sptrawler]

I'm in the exact same position. Be interested to know why a complete transition is difficult for them? Is he married to a local?

Implications of being a non-resident is a minefield with how to manage Australian investments. Also, as mentioned above health care is a concern and afaik leaving Oz for 5+ years you lose Medicare.

They aren't married but been together 14 years.