Women make poor partner choices

Wysiwyg · 23 December 2009

Through my life I have seen many many women make poor partner choices. We read about high profile footballers messing up their partners and it is easy to blame the men but the woman decides who she wants to be with. Not only do they choose the wrong partner but they stay with them.

Just tonight for the second time in two months, the fellow down the road went off his trolley. Smashed a metre square window pane and bottle on the road, along with verbal abuse. And the woman stays with him.

Now this all totals up well for sadomasochistic relationships and it may be the psychological driver in many cases which is all good and well because these type of people need each other. So? Maybe I have answered my own question.

Other cases involve women that partner with the wrong male because she wants to birth a child. Now this is more of a selfish desire by the woman to feel complete so is very different from the first relationship example. The relationship dissolves within a few months to years and the reason is obvious.

Another and least prevalent example is the woman who likes being around the criminal/tough-guy type. The thrill of watching him beat up on someone or to desecrate private property keeps them from what would otherwise be a boring life.

I don't have evidence behind the following reason because it is just my own thoughts on the matter. Women hang with the nasty men to placate them so they aren't as greater threat to the community. Relieving them of testosterone so as they aren't as destructive. In a form of martyrdom they feel they are doing the community a service.

So why do women make these choices? My samples are of Australian women and since they are human beings I assume it happens in other parts of the world.

wayneL · 23 December 2009

It is bewildering Wys'. Often these women are attractive and capable, yet they still stay with the abuser. I heard once that 1 in 3 women are abused by their partner to some degree.

If true, that is a terrible statistic.

I suppose we've all had female friends that have been through all this, we certainly have. It is shocking and the behaviour of these clowns is like something from another planet.

Some women make excellent choices however, take my wife for instance....

Fishbulb · 23 December 2009

Thanks, I haven't read this many generalisations, and ill informed, half-baked "observations" on women and their psychological state for some time. Very entertaining.

Knobby22 · 23 December 2009

wayneL said:
Some women make excellent choices however, take my wife for instance....

My wife too. Maybe the problem is that there aren't enough great guys like us going around.

Bushman · 23 December 2009

My response is what type of man would abuse the person he supposedly loves? I am tired of society protecting these man-children who refuse to take responsibility for their actions/anger management issues and get the help they need. They seek to control through violence for whatever reason and it is pathetic if was not so serious for the other person involved.

This is topical for me at the moment as I have been helping my sister leave an abusive partner. She is no victim (university educated, full time job etc) but sometimes life throws up a curve ball and you find yourself trapped in a situation that is difficult to extract yourself from. This culminated in me having to go to her house awhile back and get her out of her house because the man she used to love had been telling her that he is going to bash/kill her if she leaves and that he would kill himself if she left him. Anyway I literally had to pull him off her and get her in the car. Not a pleasant situation but at least she is out now and back in control of her life.

Tough guy hey. Take responsibility for your actions and get the help you need.

For anyone in an abusive relationship and feeling trapped because you are scared of the consequences of leaving, there are options out there. Have a read of this web-site - the main problem is recognising that you are being abused in the first place and then being scared of your partner, financial situation, children's future etc. But abuse and violence is never ok under any circumstances!

www.dvirc.org.au/

W - I can understand why you are perplexed by these choices women make and it is something that I have been curious about in the past as well. But then one day it is you sister/friend involved and it changes your perspective.

SM Junkie · 23 December 2009

Fishbulb said:
Thanks, I haven't read this many generalisations, and ill informed, half-baked "observations" on women and their psychological state for some time. Very entertaining.

I see what your saying, but a bit blunt. So to through some light on the question of why women stay.

Firstly physical abuse does not happen in issolation, the emotional abuse is what maintains control and keeps women trapped. Over time women in abusive relationships are left as shells of their former selves, they have been stripped of their self-esteem, live in constant fear for themselves and as well as for their children.

Fact - women are more likely to die at the hands of their partner than any other cause? scary isn't it.

So what happens - it's the cycle of abuse:

Explosion -> remorse phase -> Pursuit phase -> Honeymoon phase -> Build up phase -> Stand-over phase -> Explosion.

Between the remores and honeymoon phase is the most powerful time and is when women make the decision to stay or return to the relationship.

So if you are helping someone escape violence, then make yourself aware of the emotional state they will be going through.

Are are many more reasons why women stay, including their family of origin history, but there is a whole course on this subject and nothing that can be explained in a few lines here.

Julia · 23 December 2009

SM Junkie said:
I see what your saying, but a bit blunt. So to through some light on the question of why women stay.

Firstly physical abuse does not happen in issolation, the emotional abuse is what maintains control and keeps women trapped. Over time women in abusive relationships are left as shells of their former selves, they have been stripped of their self-esteem, live in constant fear for themselves and as well as for their children.

Fact - women are more likely to die at the hands of their partner than any other cause? scary isn't it.

So what happens - it's the cycle of abuse:

Explosion -> remorse phase -> Pursuit phase -> Honeymoon phase -> Build up phase -> Stand-over phase -> Explosion.

Between the remores and honeymoon phase is the most powerful time and is when women make the decision to stay or return to the relationship.

So if you are helping someone escape violence, then make yourself aware of the emotional state they will be going through.

Are are many more reasons why women stay, including their family of origin history, but there is a whole course on this subject and nothing that can be explained in a few lines here.

I'd say pretty much the same, SM Junkie. It's so easy to look at these situations from the outside and say "why does she stay"?
And it's not restricted to women with low intelligence or poor education.
The emotional control exerted by the men can be immense.

And sometimes the level of fear if she does leave can be worse than that if she stays. I've known women who have spent their lives running from place to place with their children. Somehow he finds out where they are. They have orders against him, of course, but these often are of little use.

If you know women in this situation - and sometimes there's no physical abuse, it's all verbal and psychological, financial too, - don't just say "why don't you just leave?" Rather, help them to find support agencies who will work with them.

Fishbulb · 23 December 2009

SM Junkie said:
I see what your saying, but a bit blunt. So to through some light on the question of why women stay.

Firstly physical abuse does not happen in issolation, the emotional abuse is what maintains control and keeps women trapped. Over time women in abusive relationships are left as shells of their former selves, they have been stripped of their self-esteem, live in constant fear for themselves and as well as for their children.

Fact - women are more likely to die at the hands of their partner than any other cause? scary isn't it.

So what happens - it's the cycle of abuse:

Explosion -> remorse phase -> Pursuit phase -> Honeymoon phase -> Build up phase -> Stand-over phase -> Explosion.

Between the remores and honeymoon phase is the most powerful time and is when women make the decision to stay or return to the relationship.

So if you are helping someone escape violence, then make yourself aware of the emotional state they will be going through.

Are are many more reasons why women stay, including their family of origin history, but there is a whole course on this subject and nothing that can be explained in a few lines here.

Fair enough. I don't mind being blunt, but my apologies if I was harsh.

The original post assumes that women somehow hold all the cards, and based upon on that erronious assumption, seeks to create life scenarios. In short, that they bring the pain down upon themselves. It's very short-sighted.

Women are no different to men in the choices they make; for better or for worse. Men have as much destructive/creative power as women within a relationship.

It's a highly complex issue and one that I'm certain will reveal interesting mindsets if it continues being discussed here.

Calliope · 23 December 2009

My hairdresser reckons women make bad partner choices. He thinks they make good friends, but poor partners. That's why he is shacked up with another guy.

moXJO · 23 December 2009

Julia said:
and sometimes there's no physical abuse, it's all verbal and psychological, financial too, - don't just say "why don't you just leave?" Rather, help them to find support agencies who will work with them.

I know a lot of men in this situation. Men are just as likely to make poor choices as women. I have a long list of men that are abused both physically and psychologically. The difference though is men are taught to suck it up and hide it. Men are also much poorer at dealing with emotions or having a support network in that regard. Men are in the same boat when it comes to poor choice I'm afraid.

moXJO · 23 December 2009

Calliope said:
My hairdresser reckons women make bad partner choices. He thinks they make good friends, but poor partners. That's why he is shacked up with another guy.

Hmmm mo hairdresser might be a bit biased

Bushman · 23 December 2009

SM Junkie said:
Fact - women are more likely to die at the hands of their partner than any other cause? scary isn't it.

So what happens - it's the cycle of abuse:

Explosion -> remorse phase -> Pursuit phase -> Honeymoon phase -> Build up phase -> Stand-over phase -> Explosion.

Between the remores and honeymoon phase is the most powerful time and is when women make the decision to stay or return to the relationship.

So if you are helping someone escape violence, then make yourself aware of the emotional state they will be going through.

Thanks for this and you are right about needing to understand the emotional state. It is a very complex issue.

wayneL · 23 December 2009

Julia said:
I'd say pretty much the same, SM Junkie. It's so easy to look at these situations from the outside and say "why does she stay"?
And it's not restricted to women with low intelligence or poor education.
The emotional control exerted by the men can be immense.

And sometimes the level of fear if she does leave can be worse than that if she stays. I've known women who have spent their lives running from place to place with their children. Somehow he finds out where they are. They have orders against him, of course, but these often are of little use.

If you know women in this situation - and sometimes there's no physical abuse, it's all verbal and psychological, financial too, - don't just say "why don't you just leave?" Rather, help them to find support agencies who will work with them.

Indeed.

It can't be easy to "just leave". The @ssholes have the avoidance of this eventuality well planned and make it VERY difficult (impossible in their mind) to do so.

A big tick to Harcourts Hawkes Bay BTW, whom I have found out have sent their yearly Christmas collection to the local women's refuge.

Wysiwyg · 23 December 2009

Thanks everyone and I'm so glad for your sister Bushman.

From the perspectives and experience so far it shows that women feel helpless and unable to leave after realising they made the wrong partner choice. The fear of physical assault or concern for a child's safety, they live with the nasties hoping everything will be alright tomorrow. Financial reasons are another reason why women stay. The pleasure of lifestyle balances the pain of abuse.

Co-dependency is a state of mind not often realised.

The human disease of ‘co-dependency’ is widespread. It's estimated that the greater majority of individuals have experienced an emotionally dysfunctional childhood. It’s suggested that any child who grew up in a dysfunctional family has developed the disease of co-dependency.

What is co-dependency? Co-dependency is a dis-ease of being outer-focused rather than being able to healthily detach from people and situations to focus on and take care of Self. Co-dependency is an unhealthy dependency on outer circumstances.

Evidently these situations don't happen overnight and the initial loving stage fades away to be replaced by the first put down or harsh words. The dominance/submission begins and the very first acceptance of this paves the way for more to come.

Agentm · 23 December 2009

i know plenty of women who have physically and mentally abused their children, and to see the cycle continue down through the generations is sad indeed

sure abuse is taught to you, and sure abuse is a very hard subject to understand, but unless you take a good view of the overall picture, and see how it travels down the line, through mother to child and father to child.. it requires a lot of understanding and the cycle of violence keeps rolling down the generations unimpeded

humans are not born abusive, they are seeing in in their environments and repeating it, learning and repeating.

women abuse, men abuse, its all tragic,,

help, support and see things a different way.. there are paths out of the cycle of violence. difficult for many to accept or agree to challenge. but there are solutions

Wysiwyg · 30 December 2009

Wysiwyg said:
Just tonight for the second time in two months, the fellow down the road went off his trolley.

Well interesting developments this morning with the arrival of police and subsequent incarceration of the hot headed young man. Scene of domestic argument became destructive with item being smashed, car panels knocked and loud verbals.

Hot headed young man took offense to police presence so was promptly restricted and removed from the scene. Young lady has now an angry man to face again at some time in the future. I wonder what they saw in each other at the beginning.

Mad World -- Gary Jules anyone.

Aussiest · 30 December 2009

Wysiwyg said:
Through my life I have seen many many women make poor partner choices. We read about high profile footballers messing up their partners and it is easy to blame the men but the woman decides who she wants to be with. Not only do they choose the wrong partner but they stay with them.

Just tonight for the second time in two months, the fellow down the road went off his trolley. Smashed a metre square window pane and bottle on the road, along with verbal abuse. And the woman stays with him.

Now this all totals up well for sadomasochistic relationships and it may be the psychological driver in many cases which is all good and well because these type of people need each other. So? Maybe I have answered my own question.

Other cases involve women that partner with the wrong male because she wants to birth a child. Now this is more of a selfish desire by the woman to feel complete so is very different from the first relationship example. The relationship dissolves within a few months to years and the reason is obvious.

Another and least prevalent example is the woman who likes being around the criminal/tough-guy type. The thrill of watching him beat up on someone or to desecrate private property keeps them from what would otherwise be a boring life.

I don't have evidence behind the following reason because it is just my own thoughts on the matter. Women hang with the nasty men to placate them so they aren't as greater threat to the community. Relieving them of testosterone so as they aren't as destructive. In a form of martyrdom they feel they are doing the community a service.

So why do women make these choices? My samples are of Australian women and since they are human beings I assume it happens in other parts of the world.

There is much psychological theory that suggests that people prefer to have their own true opinion of themselves reinforced rather than what they want you to believe. For eg, if their facade suggests they are "confident", but underneath they are actually hiding an insecure "self", then they would feel more comfortable having their "insecure self" reinforced. The interesting thing about the research is that it suggests that human beings prefer to be seen for "who they are", rather than what they want you to believe.

This theory even suggests that that is what explains the "battered wife syndrome" - that people (women) stay with abusers because underneath it all their low self esteem is satisfied by the poor treatment.

I can't cite the source of the research as it was a very long time ago that I studied it at Uni, but if you Google "social psychology" and then add a relevant term, you may be able to find it. I'll try to have a look around today...

Aussiest · 30 December 2009

Agentm said:
humans are not born abusive, they are seeing in in their environments and repeating it, learning and repeating.

women abuse, men abuse, its all tragic,,

help, support and see things a different way.. there are paths out of the cycle of violence. difficult for many to accept or agree to challenge. but there are solutions

Part of it is poor coping skills i guess. Also, there is a part of the brain known as the "amygdala" that governs primal behaviour. If this is out of whack or damanged in some way (or just poorly developed), anger and voilence could be the ensuring result. This is known as an "amygdala hijack"... Google it!

Mr J · 30 December 2009

Many people make poor partner choices. For better and worse, the vast majority of people let emotions guide their decisions.

Julia · 30 December 2009

Mr J said:
Many people make poor partner choices. For better and worse, the vast majority of people let emotions guide their decisions.

A fate which I imagine will never happen to you, Mr J.

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