Who are you voting for?

Rafa · 19 November 2007

This is the most scary prospect of futher liberal power...
If there is one and only one reason to get rid of the liberals in Oz and the Repiblicans in the US, is their association with right wing churches.

It also shows more blatant missuse of the secrecy provisions...

JOHN Howard has exchanged letters five times with the Exclusive Brethren since 2003, but after 14 months of stalling on a simple freedom-of-information request, his office will not release the correspondence until well after election day.

The Age was informed last week that it was authorised to receive edited copies of four letters from members of the secretive sect to the Prime Minister, and one from the Prime Minister to the Brethren sent as recently as September last year.

But the release was delayed by another 30 days to give the Brethren a chance to appeal against the decision, taking the earliest date of receipt of the correspondence to December 13 ”” three weeks after voters decide if Mr Howard will remain Prime Minister.

It is the first time the Prime Minister's office has acknowledged any correspondence with the religious sect with which the Prime Minister has had very close contact over many years. Mr Howard was embarrassed in August when The Age revealed he had met Brethren world leader, Bruce Hales, and at least one sect member who is under police investigation over his role in funding pro-Liberal campaign advertisements in the 2004 election.

Greens leader Bob Brown said the Government had once again manipulated the FoI Act to hide information. Mr Brown was told by the Prime Minister's department, in response to his own FoI request in 2005, that "no records of correspondence with persons identifying as representatives of the Exclusive Brethren … were located". The response to The Age reveals that three relevant documents existed.

"I was lied to. That's clear. Straight deception," Senator Brown said. "But I'm used to it with the Government."

.
.
.

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2007/11/18/1195321608622.html

numbercruncher · 19 November 2007

Rafa said:
This is the most scary prospect of futher liberal power...

Absolutely

And thats before we even start on this chap ....

The Mint Man · 19 November 2007

I'm voting Liberal but I've got to say that I'm surprised at the poll result so far! Liberals are killing it!: considering the Galexy polls etc I'm

I just don't see any substance in what Rudd says. We need someone who leads from the front, not sit back and see what the other 'mob' does then use that as a rule of thumb or straight out copy it.
Too much copy cating for mine

Cheers

numbercruncher · 19 November 2007

I cant see how anyone could possibly think Labor doesnt lead from the front .... Johnny only discovered climate change 5 minutes ago ...

Hell Costello didnt even know that we are experiencing high Inflation, If he had any idea they would of called the election prior to the RBA meeting.

Asleep on the job for sure.

nioka · 19 November 2007

The Mint Man said:
I'm voting Liberal but I've got to say that I'm surprised at the poll result so far! Liberals are killing it!: considering the Galexy polls etc I'm Cheers

I'm surprised too but not the same way as you are. Howard should be ahead by a long way with an ASF audience who are interested in investing for profit. If he doesn't have a clear mandate here he will not get it out in the REAL world.

Julia · 19 November 2007

rederob said:
Julia
Labor sent its key policies in for costing, and began on 26 October.
The Charter only allows Finance/Treasury to cost policies after the PM puts government into caretaker mode.
There is no capacity for the Opposition to have Treasury/Finance cost their policies without the government's consent, and the PM's once caretaker mode is invoked.
My earlier posted link can provide all the info you need on this issue.
It's a great con job that you and others seemed to have been sucked into if you believe Labor has dodged "costings", and who exactly has been perpetuating it?
Not another scare tactic from the Libs, surely?

Hello Rob,

Could "key" policies be similar to "core" promises, perhaps?
i.e. they can choose which ones Treasury are to have a look at?

So, just to be clear, are you saying that absolutely all that Labor has promised has been submitted for verification of their costings and thus we may be completely confident that none of their promises will fail to come to fruition should they form the government?

numbercruncher · 19 November 2007

PM accuses Rudd of getting cocky

PRIME Minister John Howard has kicked off his final campaign week by accusing Kevin Rudd of acting as if he had already won the election.

Asked what he planned to be doing next Sunday, Mr Howard replied: "Preparing for our fifth term in government. I will be talking to the treasurer and the deputy prime minister about that, and receiving some briefings from the head of my department about that, that is my plan.

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,22780458-952,00.html

Um ... So who is it getting cocky again, im confused ??

2020hindsight · 19 November 2007

So here's a hypothetical .. (long odds this one) ...

John Howard loses Bennalong, but Libs still win overall. (he is the 15th seat to fall, and Labor need 16 etc )
Then one of his underlings resigns to permit him to stand in a bi-election, and resume his prime-ministerialship.
- let's say for sake of argument that Ruddock resigns from Berowra. (northern suburbs of Sydney). Johnny is then member for Berowra.
http://www.aph.gov.au/house/members/member.asp?id=0J4

Then does Johnny have to move from Kirribilli. ? (I don't even know where Johnny's real home is lol - probably up near Gordon somewhere?)

I mean Maxine had to sell up and move to Bennalong to be given the chance to challenge him. That's a big call (and a lot of inconvenience) on her part.

(just a jest - and thousand to one - don't sweat over this one - call it a "riddle" - then again , stranger things have happened).

zt3000 · 19 November 2007

Rafa said:
good work Mark...

I acutually think the poll should be only
Labor
Libs
Other with Pref to Labor
Other with Pref to Libs

Thats really all that matters as far as the lower house goes, with the preferential form of voting, plus it keeps things simple and to what really matter, i.e. which party do you want to form government?

thats actually a pretty good idea i like .. they should also have a donkey vote category ... would be funny if that was the preffered vote ahaha

noirua · 19 November 2007

There is the all important question here "Will Kevin Rudd ruin the Australian Mining boom?" - click on video.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22539854-11949,00.html

2020hindsight · 19 November 2007

If Howard leapfrogs Rudd and ends up ahead in the final poll

would that be called a Poll Vault ?
(sorry ABC, blatant plagiarism on my part )

(PS I notice Anthony Green calls em by-elections )

numbercruncher · 19 November 2007

noirua said:
There is the all important question here "Will Kevin Rudd ruin the Australian Mining boom?" - click on video.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22539854-11949,00.html

Only question I have is how much more boom will Rudd add to Mining !!

After all he is fluent mandarin and the Chinese President has already invited Rudd as his guest at the Beijing olympics. I didnt see Liberals get an invite as Presidental guests ...

Resource bulls will surely want to vote Rudd !

rederob · 19 November 2007

Julia said:
Hello Rob,

Could "key" policies be similar to "core" promises, perhaps?
i.e. they can choose which ones Treasury are to have a look at?

So, just to be clear, are you saying that absolutely all that Labor has promised has been submitted for verification of their costings and thus we may be completely confident that none of their promises will fail to come to fruition should they form the government?

Julia
The Charter does not require any policies to be submitted for costing: It simply provides a basis for ensuring that if either the Coalition or Labor Party makes a policy/promise, it can be costed against a budget figure.
It also has an "independent umpire" flavour, so that one can't say the other is fudging their figures.
There is no requirement that the policy be implemented.
Moreover, the parties can make more policy announcements this week if they want, but they might not be in time to be costed as a 5 day timeframe is preferred (not essential - just based on best endeavours).
I can't tell you if "all" policies have been submitted for costing.
But I can tell you that both the Coalition and Labor parties have equally submitted 33 policies for costing.
Major media outlets have tallied up each of the respective parties' costings and thus far Labor has not racked up a bill that matches the Coalition's expenditure.
It does seem that many people have no idea what the Charter is about, and many also have swallowed some bogus line that Labor is not submitting policies for costing.
By the way, I haven't voted Labor for at least 20 years, and this year will not be any different.

numbercruncher · 19 November 2007

Interesting vote tally so far especially seen as in theory this type of forum should have a liberal bias ....

65 Lib and Prefs
69 Labor and Pref (incl green)

glenn_r · 19 November 2007

numbercruncher said:
Only question I have is how much more boom will Rudd add to Mining !!

After all he is fluent mandarin and the Chinese President has already invited Rudd as his guest at the Beijing olympics. I didnt see Liberals get an invite as Presidental guests ...

Resource bulls will surely want to vote Rudd !

You believe the reason the Chinese are buying our natural resources is because of who is in Government?

I'm still waiting to hear from Rudd as to how Labor will "control" interest rates and the union driven wages and conditions explosion, which eventually the consumer (you) will have to pay for.

mark70920 · 19 November 2007

glenn_r said:
You believe the reason the Chinese are buying our natural resources is because of who is in Government?

I'm still waiting to hear from Rudd as to how Labor will "control" interest rates and the union driven wages and conditions explosion, which eventually the consumer (you) will have to pay for.

The sky is falling the sky is falling , there won't be a union driven wages explosion. Just more of the ill informed scare campaign.

Let me expalin how inflation works , relevant to labour costs.
Pay rises are only inflationary if they are not accompanied by an increase in productivity, so if someone produces 10 items a week at a labor cost of a $1000 ($100 an item) and then get a pay rise of 10% ($1100) each item would now have labor cost of $110 , that causes inflation but if he now produces 11 items a week the labor cost would still be $100 an item , that’s not inflationary.
So if the business you work for is producing more with less staff you deserve a pay rise and that won't affect inflation.
What both parties need to do to keep the lid on inflation and therefore interest rates, is to increase the productivity of our workforce. They need to be better trained , innovative and motivated. We need to invest in infrastructure again to help increase productivity.
There is no evidence that AWA's increase productivity and in fact the international evidence points to collective agreements(over individual agreements) giving the biggest increases in productivity.
Keep the lid on inflation vote for the party with the most productive IR plan and stop Listening to John Howard’s Lies.

noco · 19 November 2007

The Mint Man said:
I'm voting Liberal but I've got to say that I'm surprised at the poll result so far! Liberals are killing it!: considering the Galexy polls etc I'm

I just don't see any substance in what Rudd says. We need someone who leads from the front, not sit back and see what the other 'mob' does then use that as a rule of thumb or straight out copy it.
Too much copy cating for mine

Cheers

I'm with you Mint Man. When you see the ASF poll the Libs 44.03% to Lab 38.06%
I would dearly like to know how the Morgan and Nielson polls are carried out.

It appears to me they do their polling in well known Labor strong holds, which indicates they are biased and are yearning for a change in Government for the sake of change.

We have in Townsville a company called AEC WHO CONDUCTED A POLL favouring Labor. The principal of AEC I believe has been involved with campaigning for Labor candidates in the past.

The same company did a poll on the two competing Mayors in the up and coming Local Gov. elections and AEC stated Labor Mayor Mooney would rump in. However, two other polls showed (a) 80% to 20% in favour of Mayor Tyrell from Thuringowa and (b) 79% to 21% in favour of Mayor Tyrell.

The ASF poll is not the only one I have observed favouring the Libs. Unfortunately, the mentality of some people will look at the Morgan poll and will vote the way the polls show, just to be on the winning side.

numbercruncher · 19 November 2007

glenn_r said:
You believe the reason the Chinese are buying our natural resources is because of who is in Government?

No ...

But i believe whomever is in Government definately can build on and expand our business dealings.

And for this you need to understand Chinese culture, build relationships , expand trust and dialogue, Rudd will deliver on this for sure, as can be seen by this sneak preview of Rudd's interaction with the President of China.

Our relationship with China should be expanded past the supply and demand curve to a level where China prefers to deal with Australia.

Rudd will deliver, Costello will kick back asleep at the wheel.

Aussie2Aussie · 19 November 2007

A swinger going Liberal.

Latham could easily have been elected Prime Minister and god knows where we would be if that was the case. It showed me that Labor leadership ballots are based on either very poor judging of character or that they dont care, as long as they get over the line.

Suspect that the overly disciplined and tight leash campaign that Labor is running re Rudds personality is because of a similar flaw existing.

skint · 19 November 2007

2020hindsight said:
So here's a hypothetical .. (long odds this one) ...

John Howard loses Bennalong, but Libs still win overall. (he is the 15th seat to fall, and Labor need 16 etc )
Then one of his underlings resigns to permit him to stand in a bi-election, and resume his prime-ministerialship.
- let's say for sake of argument that Ruddock resigns from Berowra. (northern suburbs of Sydney). Johnny is then member for Berowra.
http://www.aph.gov.au/house/members/member.asp?id=0J4

Then does Johnny have to move from Kirribilli. ? (I don't even know where Johnny's real home is lol - probably up near Gordon somewhere?)

I mean Maxine had to sell up and move to Bennalong to be given the chance to challenge him. That's a big call (and a lot of inconvenience) on her part.

(just a jest - and thousand to one - don't sweat over this one - call it a "riddle" - then again , stranger things have happened).

Hi 20/20 - the possibility of Johnny winning the election but losing Bennelong is unlikely but definitely possible. I heard some commmentary recently that the Chinese and Korean communities in Bennelong (and they're large) are appearing to turn their backs on the coalition. I was in Eastwood (part of Bennelong) the other evening and it did appear that there were more Maxine McKew posters than Howard posters outside Asian businesses, although this was just an impression. Unfortunately for me and fortunately for the good folk of ASF, I live outside Bennelong by the width of a road. In other words, I could throw a stone into Bennelong. I really liked the idea of the coalition losing by one seat and Bennelong being lost by one vote (mine). I don't think ASF would ever had heard the end of it! Skint changes the course of history! Oh well, I'll have to make do with my "portfolio triples overnight" fantasy.
P.S. maybe I will give a stone a roost into Bennelong next Saturday. I might be lucky enough to land it on Howard's ugly melon.

Who are you voting for?

Who will you vote for?

Labor

Liberal

National

Other with LIB/Nat preference

Other with a Labor preference

Greens

Rafa

numbercruncher

Beware of Dropbears

The Mint Man

numbercruncher

Beware of Dropbears

nioka

Julia

In Memoriam

numbercruncher

Beware of Dropbears

2020hindsight

zt3000

noirua

2020hindsight

numbercruncher

Beware of Dropbears

rederob

numbercruncher

Beware of Dropbears

glenn_r

mark70920

noco

numbercruncher

Beware of Dropbears

Aussie2Aussie

skint

Similar threads

Who are you voting for?

Who will you vote for?

Labor

Liberal

National

Other with LIB/Nat preference

Other with a Labor preference

Greens

Beware of Dropbears

Beware of Dropbears

In Memoriam

Beware of Dropbears

Beware of Dropbears

Beware of Dropbears

Beware of Dropbears

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency