What would you do: an ethical question?

I'd be interested in members' responses to what I will describe as a hypothetical situation as follows: (names are fictitious, if it matters.)


Mary is a counsellor at a community centre. The community centre also hosts a number of other programmes, including Legal Aid.

Amongst Mary's appointments is Bill. He comes in, sits down, and when Mary asks how she can help, says "I want to hand myself in for a hit and run, but want a solicitor with me when I do it".

A couple of brief questions from Mary determine that Bill has been under the impression that his appointment was with a Legal Aid solicitor. Either he has not made his requirements clear to the receptionist, or the receptionist has made a mistake in the bookings.

Whichever, Mary is now in possession of information about a crime.

She explains the appointment error and advises him of the Legal Aid session times. She suggests he could go to the police station or the court house to ask for the duty solicitor. He does not want to do either of these.

His appearance and demeanour suggest he is either very unwell, extremely stressed (well, of course!) or somewhat "out of it" on some substance.
He says he feels very sick, and then adds that it's from the stress of worrying about what to do.

The community centre has a mandatory reporting policy if safety, especially child safety, is involved, but as this event apparently occurred some time ago, this doesn't seem to be an issue for now.

Mary has checked with Bill that he is not driving, as she considers he is in no state to drive.

She contacts the community centre's solicitor to see if she can send Bill there for legal aid advice. Yes, she can.

She tells Bill where he can go, but feels it is very unlikely that he will actually follow up on this information.

So the question is: does Mary have an ethical obligation to do any or all of the following:

(a) maintain complete client confidentiality on the basis that Bill told her what he did in the belief that he was speaking to a solicitor?

(b) contact the police with the information on the basis that she has information about a crime?

(c) consider she has fulfilled her obligations in both respects by doing neither of the above and essentially passing the decision on to the Legal Aid solicitor who also acts as solicitor for the Community Centre?

I'd very much appreciate members' reactions to this situation.

With thanks

Julia

I'd have to go with a or c.

In my opinion c is the ethical answer...you may (I am not suggesting you do, but may) have some legal responsibilities as well (the solicitor might be able to tell you if you do?)

Hi Julia

She has no legal or ethical obligation to conform to A.. C is an ostrich response and B can really be the only option as there is obviously someone out there that has been hurt or killed by this persons actions...

she should do what her conscience tells her to do. I would add that she probably already knows what she should do, but the legalities are causing a conflict over the decision making.

I would do B.

All she had to do was say "I'll get a solicitor for you". He gets the solicitor, hands himself in and there is no problem.

Mary needs to explain to Bill that she is now in a situation where she possesses information that could get her into legal trouble. It would be best if he would go and see the solicitor, and thus relieve Mary of any responsibility. The solicitor would need to contact Mary to confirm that Bill has actually attended an appointment.

Otherwise, Mary has no choice but to report the problem to someone, or to seek legal advice for her own protection.

Caution should be taken, as Bill may decide to eliminate Mary.

Mary should contact the community centre's solicitor to see if she has a legal obligation that over rides her ethical obligation, then provided there is no conflict she should ethically do whatever allows her to sleep at night.

nioka said:

All she had to do was say "I'll get a solicitor for you". He gets the solicitor, hands himself in and there is no problem.

Click to expand...

Yes, seems like a solution, Nioka. However, according to the community centre's philosophy, this would be taking responsibility away from the client who could later suggest he was misunderstood or in some way coerced.


Great responses so far. Thank you. Keep them coming.

Julia

julia
There's gotta be a d) or an e) - lets see... mmm

d) lie down until the feeling went away?
e) monitor the situation?
f) give him a week to turn himself in, then if he hasn't, wait till you see him walking along the road one dark night, put on a zorro mask, and "administer justice".

PS In the engineering game we say "monitor the structure". It's really a way of doing nothing, but pretending youre doing something. Doctors bury their mistakes, architects cover theirs with ivy, and engineers write long reports that noone ever reads anyways. (Not meaning to trivialise your problem , but you did say it was hypothetical )

cheers, 2020

PS - why not say - "I'm a solicitor - just sign this contract whereby I get $2000 per hour etc".

Hit and run.
I would grass him up.

I think that Mary has an obligation to report it to the top manager of the community center and it will be up to the manager to take action. I can see no way that this organisation can not take the responsible action, which would have to make sure that the appropriate authorities are involved.

anon

Got to remember who the real victims are here. Definitely would tell the police.

Julia said:

Yes, seems like a solution, Nioka. However, according to the community centre's philosophy, this would be taking responsibility away from the client who could later suggest he was misunderstood or in some way coerced.


Great responses so far. Thank you. Keep them coming.

Julia

Click to expand...

Bill decided not to accept responsibility when he ran, and possibly went to the centre hoping to find someone else to handle the responsibility for him and take the weight off his shoulders, sounds like he got what he wanted. I wonder if the victim or their family now feel better.

id go with D. And escort Bill to the legal aid, reaffirming that you will be there with him.

B

The Dude should go to jail and get his --- kicked for what he did.

Without all the facts available, and the possibility of extenuating circumstances, I'd go C.

However, I would follow through (possibly escorting him myself to the solicitor) to make sure he presents himself, with the option of going to B if necessary.

<edit>
There is no ethical question, you prevent him from leaving the building and call the police.


HM

B.
Stuff him- he did the crime, and said he wanted to hand himself in. Mary should tell him to go to Legal Aid, and if he doesn't, then call the police.

Julia - another factor I believe is your religion.
1)I have a hypothesis that many RC's (or even doctors etc, journalists maybe?) would hold dear not grassing.
Important to keep confidences etc. Probably something born in the confessional.
2) Personally I would grass btw. My conscience would give me hell in a day or two - let alone have to live with the fact for years.
3)Again - speaking of religion, its not as if you're handing him over to the Taliban to administer justice - you are handing him over to the Aus court system -
4) where, apart from the fact that it's a complete LOTTERY whether you get the right outcome, they disencourage linch mobs (I was joking below) , and will get "everyone's side of the story" as someone said about the blind men and the elephant . "and try to put Humpty Dumpty elephant together again"
5) always two sides to a story - "day in court and all that". I know of a hit-run where the person was walking drunk across a roundabout - the car hit him, (who knows if it was fatal) - and left the scene. Another car then ran into the body - certainly by then fatal. At least the second driver (who stopped) had "mitigating circumstances" if not a clear conscience about being involved at all. Don't know if they ever caught the first driver. (apologies - I'll check and report back - shouldnt leave stories in mid air)