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Ukraine War

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moXJO said:
Watch them put it down to Biden diplomacy.
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It would be funny, if it wasn't so serious, it was only a couple of months ago that Australia was being trashed for dumping the French subs.
I haven't heard much from Macron in the last few days, yet he was supposed to have used his incredible charm and wit, to have calmed Putin down.
No doubt Putin needed a new pair of undies after that meeting and it wouldn't have been from $hitting himself, more likely he wet himself laughing IMO.
I just hope we can get a couple of the U.S subs on afterpay, because IMO at the moment, we really could do with some form of deterrent.
I don't think a group of left wing loonies poking their tongues out, is really going to cut, when push comes to shove. ?

It would be nice if Putin agreed to do this like a man, one on one fight with the mayor of Kyiv, now I would have a lot of respect for Putin if he did that.



Or if he wasn't happy with that match up, maybe the Mayor's brother.



That would sort the Worlds problems out, it is o.k being tough when you are using other people as enforcers, why doesn't Putin man up? One of the things these two Ukrainian brothers don't lack is courage.



Klitschko brothers - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org
 
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The other thing I worry is how much data is China compiling from all this?

They get a template of what will likely happen if they take Taiwan.

US/west should be pushing Russia/China alliance through Asia and what is happening to Ukraine. They would want to start thinking the long game.
 
Reputable?

I would posit that there is no such thing in the current environment... And if there is it would be almost impossible to discern among the rest of the bull****
 
If you want to see exactly (confrontingly) what is being inflicted on the Russians in Ukraine then go to Anatoliy Sovailo's YouTube site, rather than watch MSN snippets.
If NATO can prop up the Ukranians in coming days it's hard to see Russians wanting to continue their invasion.
 
It seems to me that this invasion will likely result in the one thing Russia didn't want, ie Ukraine joining NATO.
 
SirRumpole said:
It seems to me that this invasion will likely result in the one thing Russia didn't want, ie Ukraine joining NATO.
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At this point, nothing would surprise me.

What I am sure of is that what we think is happening isn't what is happening.
 
Those trucks represent a lot of dead soldiers. Sobering. Excellent you tube site.
 
basilio said:
Those trucks represent a lot of dead soldiers. Sobering.
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I was listening to a military expert on the ABC and he was surprised that the Russians initially went in overconfident and poorly supplied. Vehicles running out of fuel and sending in small forces like the one shown on their own. The soldiers thought they were on a training drill and when it turned real the leadership seemed unprepared.

They won't make the same mistake twice. I hope therefore a deal is struck with Ukraine and it ends this war.

The oligarchs probably thought they would each get a piece of Ukraine.
Now that it is they that will be suffering under western sanctions, it may lead them to consider the overthrowal of Putin.
Caligula and Indira Ghandi are some of the many leaders killed by their own protection.
 
wayneL said:
At this point, nothing would surprise me.

What I am sure of is that what we think is happening isn't what is happening.
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You are spot on @wayneL

The biggest issue is yet to unfold, what did Putin and Xi agreed to? One would guess it has something to do with currencies, trade or arms manufacturing IMO.

Let's not forget what Trump was trying to sort out, the trade imbalance, the U.S, Australia, the E.U rely on most of their manufactured goods from China.

China hasn't shown its hand yet, until that happens, I wouldn't be doing the high fives and fist pumping.
 
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China has their issues as well, but can't deny the effort their government puts in to bettering the living conditions of *most* of their own people (except the Uyghurs, minorities, dissenters, etc)

Putin has only ever looked after himself and his mates (who are only his mates because he lets them rob billions off Russians) and Russia has gone backwards in 20 years. Deep down I can't imagine XI or China has much time for Putin and they probably only deal with him out of necessity and to piss off the west a little.
 
Absolutely, China as usual will be watching, to see where the money is to be made.
That IMO is why the EU is stepping it up, if they don't it will end up a World of pain for them.
My guess is the U.S is watching the Pacific side of things, the last thing the U.S needs is China to have our raw earths, lithium, nickel, uranium etc you name it, they get it.
My guess would be, several of the U.S fleets, will be moving to the Pacific region.
Winston Churchill was right, when he said we should just go on through to Russia and have it democratic.
What did Churchill wanted after ww2?


Each leader had an agenda for the Yalta Conference: Roosevelt wanted Soviet support in the U.S. Pacific War against Japan and Soviet participation in the UN; Churchill pressed for free elections and democratic governments in Eastern and Central Europe (specifically Poland); and Stalin demanded a Soviet sphere
 
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sptrawler said:
My guess is the U.S is watching the Pacific side of things, the last thing the U.S needs is China to have our raw earths, lithium, nickel, uranium, you name it they get it.
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Ahhh, They'll be fine. Clearly you don't pay attention the ASX penny casino! There are a few dozen junior explorers out there all ready to put their amazing world class West Australian lithium/rare earth/nickel/uranium prospects into production and they'll all be zero carbon green gender neutral producers supplying Tesla
 
And only employing lgbtqia+, white male or female Christian hetrosexual's need not apply, especially if your married with children, don't bring your baggage.
They will want to be inclusive, so that gets rid of most of us, you will be vetted by an extremely well off person who is smug, has a social conscience, thinks of themselves as a small time philanthropist and smugly votes Labor, just to touch base with the unwashed masses. ?
 
SirRumpole said:
It seems to me that this invasion will likely result in the one thing Russia didn't want, ie Ukraine joining NATO.
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I don't think that will happen. Russia most likely will go harder. They are securing Russia friendly areas of the Ukraine. But underestimated the resistance in many places.

The big mistake was they sent one echelon no second. If you want to blitz you need multiple echelons securing behind you and reinforcing those at the front. You keep supply lines open this way with areas locked down. They sweep up any defenders by overwhelming with further troops heading up the rear.

Now the last time Russia fought Ukraine they ran over the top of them. Ukraine anti tank, grenades, shells were 99% defective along with the rest of their crud equipment. But Russia did not wipe them all out.

So Ukraine adapted. Rotated a lot of troops through donbass (close to half a mill potentially). So that's a lot of experience. New equipment. I'm hearing the Turkish drones are causing huge damage. Upgraded weapons and the javelins from the US. So from roughly 2014 to now they are a completely different force.

Putin is between a rock and a hard place though. No telling what he might unleash if NATO goes ahead and makes Ukraine a part of it. Personally I think they will overstep a line. My guess is more troops or an agreement.

This whole thing seems weird and half arsed. It's like he planned for everything else but the actual invasion.
 
Spot on @moXJO if Putin kicks sand in the face of the EU, and gets away with it, the EU is toast and everything goes back to the old USSR.
My guess is a negotiated cease fire and find common ground, but China hasn't played its hand yet.
The big all encompassing agreement between Putin and Xi, days before the attack on the Ukraine, doesn't make sense unless it was a precursor to this.
So why hasn't China shown its hand?
 
I think China already played its hand?

They are sitting back saying to all the African/Asian/South American countries 'look at Russia, look at the US, look at the EU - they are a bunch of childish war mongering turkeys. Come do business with us, we're stable and forward thinking' China gains a lot more by exploiting developing nations and displacing the traditional Euro/American influence. China doesn't have much to gain by taking Taiwan and this little Russia-Ukraine war would have certainly dampened the mood in China for doing anything silly.

If I were China I would be sitting back with a bag of prawn crackers waiting for Russia to start begging me for better economic ties.
 
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