TradeSim

[nizar]

Does any1 here use this and what do you think about it?

Any other alternatives out there for systems testing?

And does this have to be used with metastock?

Enterprise edition on its own - isnt that enough?

 

[tech/a]

Nizar.

Send me a private mail and I'll give you my phone number too much to post here.

 

[MichaelD]

Backtesting is a huge topic - covered both here (from memory) and extensively on Reef.

The biggest thing TradeSim can achieve is to give you enough confidence in a system to trade it without question and to have a fair idea when the system is failing.

Be warned, though, that there is quite a learning curve - if you can write formulas in MetaStock or Excel then you should be OK. You need MetaStock to be able to use TradeSim.

AmiBroker can also apparently backtest.

 

[tech/a]

Currently Amibroker and Bullcharts are capable of running Tradesim as well as Metastock.

Enterprise edition will eliminate hrs of loading various timeframes and start dates,as Montecarlo testing will do 1000 of portfolio tests of the one search.

Singular systems testing is dangerous---Metastock users who have attempted to use the inbuilt systems testing would know this (regardless of version).

 

[bingk6]

I am interested in evaluating Tradesim Enterprise version, but the pricing of $1500 is not for the faint hearted and would be considered by people who are serious in their system development.

Anybody else interested in trying to put together a group purchase so that we can qualify for a bit of a discount ??

 

[nizar]

I am interested in evaluating Tradesim Enterprise version, but the pricing of $1500 is not for the faint hearted and would be considered by people who are serious in their system development.

Anybody else interested in trying to put together a group purchase so that we can qualify for a bit of a discount ??

Umm yeh but how would we do that??
Any practical ideas?

 

[bingk6]

Umm yeh but how would we do that??
Any practical ideas?

No guarantees here off course, but if we can get a count as to the number of people who are considering this package (say x people), we can goto tradesim and see if they are prepared to offer a discount. Mind you, if x = 1,2 or 3 then not much is going to happen. But if x >= 10, then maybe we are half a chance.

 

[stevo]

Does any1 here use this and what do you think about it?

Any other alternatives out there for systems testing?

And does this have to be used with metastock?

Enterprise edition on its own - isnt that enough?

I use it with Amibroker, although I started with the Metastock / TradeSim combo. This software was a real eye opener when I first discovered it. Most of the systems / indicators mentioned in books didn't work (at least on the markets I was testing)! TradeSim is very powerful software for backtesting purposes.

I use Amibroker for system testing purposes. Monte Carlo simulations can also be done with AB by copy and pasting into Excel. I have some example MC charts on my blog. I always test using TradeSim before I finalise a system so I can further explore & confirm position sizing strategies.

Roy (www.metastocktips.co.nz) also has Trade Equity for Metastock - I started with Trade Equity first since it is free.

TradeSim doesn't generate the trades - Metastock or similar software is required for this purpose. TradeSim takes all the trades and tests them using different portfolio criteria - position size, maximum number of trades, brokerage , etc. It also can do Monte Carlo simulations if you have the right version.

 

[tech/a]

Hmm.

Think you'll be pushing it.
David Samborsky is the brilliant mind who developed and continues to develope Tradesim.
As far as I know he has agreements with distributors for Tradesim.
As such I think you'll find he cant do sweetheart deals.

I strongly advise saving up and supporting a brilliant Australian who has put in countless hrs and developed a world class product.

The $1500 is after all Tax deductable and the value of a good trade.

http://compuvision.com.au/

Is the link.

 

[nizar]

Is TradeSim the only product out there that can do MonteCarlo analysis?

Steve - Thanks for your response; while i got you here just want to ask about your exits on your weekly system, do you use a profit taking exit or a time stop and if not why?

Thanks

 

[MichaelD]

This software was a real eye opener when I first discovered it. Most of the systems / indicators mentioned in books didn't work (at least on the markets I was testing)!

Got to agree with this - it's quite gobsmacking when you find this out for the first time and realize that the answer isn't in the latest Stochastic RSI Williams Swing indicator.

Also, to those baulking at the $1,500 price tag (+ MetaStock) - a backtesting engine is probably the most effective way to give yourself the confidence you need to trade your plan through the good and the bad. It is a characteristic of traders to give up on their plan at just the wrong moment (such as towards the end of initial drawdown). Using TradeSim gives you a very, very good idea of when things are likely to turn around. In bear markets, this confidence makes the price of TradeSim seem very small.

Consider this. My long term trend following system was specifically designed to minimize drawdown - it uses 0.5% risk and pyramiding. A characteristic of such a system is quite lengthy runs of small losses. TradeSim told me I could have up to 22 losses in a row.

Since I started the system in May last year, I've had a run of 19 losses in a row...and I've also seen open equity increase by 33%. How many of you would have been happy trading a system with so many losses in a row? I had no problems coping with it, because I had already worked out that such a scenario was possible.

 

[brownegaz]

I use Tradesim Professional version which does single average trade simulations which can be a bit misleading, the Enterprise version does Monte Carlo simulations and runs 10000 simulations on the trades that have been triggerd by your system(using Metastock), it then prints out reports and averages the results so you have a far better understanding of how your system has performed over your selected time frame.
I am seriously looking at upgrading to the Enterprise version,and as tech/a says its tax deductable and the cost would be recouped in one reasonable trade.

I believe Wealth Lab is also a very worthy tool for backtesting however I dont have any experience with it.

brownegaz

 

[nizar]

I use Tradesim Professional version which does single average trade simulations which can be a bit misleading, the Enterprise version does Monte Carlo simulations and runs 10000 simulations on the trades that have been triggerd by your system(using Metastock), it then prints out reports and averages the results so you have a far better understanding of how your system has performed over your selected time frame.
I am seriously looking at upgrading to the Enterprise version,and as tech/a says its tax deductable and the cost would be recouped in one reasonable trade.

I believe Wealth Lab is also a very worthy tool for backtesting however I dont have any experience with it.

brownegaz

Yeh i think montecarlo analysis is essential so i will get enterprise for sure.
But apart from this, what other advantages does TradeSim offer over the backtesting capabilities of metastock or amibroker?

Youd think theyd have some sort of demo or something so people know what their about to buy........

 

[nizar]

Yeh i think montecarlo analysis is essential so i will get enterprise for sure.
But apart from this, what other advantages does TradeSim offer over the backtesting capabilities of metastock or amibroker?

Youd think theyd have some sort of demo or something so people know what their about to buy........

Just bringing this page to the main screeen.

 

[nizar]

Does tradesim work just as well with older versions of metastock say version 8 or 9?

 

[MichaelD]

TradeSim works fine with MetaStock 7 onwards.

 

[nizar]

Hi guys.
Can you run tradesim without metastock?

Because im not going to need metastock until i am forward trading the system ie. in realtime, at which stage i will also need (end of day) data.

For backtesting, and systems design and development, all i need is tradesim and historical data -- Correct?

So back to my original question -- can you run tradesim without metastock?

Thanks.

 

[nizar]

Hi guys.
Can you run tradesim without metastock?

Because im not going to need metastock until i am forward trading the system ie. in realtime, at which stage i will also need (end of day) data.

For backtesting, and systems design and development, all i need is tradesim and historical data -- Correct?

So back to my original question -- can you run tradesim without metastock?

Thanks.

Any responses please gents.

 

[Sir Burr]

Hi guys.
So back to my original question -- can you run tradesim without metastock?

You can run it with any software which can spit the trade details out.

AFAIK - Metastock, Amibroker, Bullcharts, Tradestation.

Tradesim will not test a system on it's own. Tradesim is software that will give statistics from your trade data.

Another similar is http://www.adaptrade.com/

 

[Temjin]

Is TradeSim the only product out there that can do MonteCarlo analysis?

Steve - Thanks for your response; while i got you here just want to ask about your exits on your weekly system, do you use a profit taking exit or a time stop and if not why?

Thanks

TradingBlox can also do MonteCarlo analysis.