Traders International - Trading S&P500 Eminis + FX

Re: Traders International - Trading S&P500 Eminis

wayneL said:

It in no way reflects the amount of capital required to trade futures.


For a fair dinkum trader, margin is inconsequential as you will need some cash reserves (most say a minimum in the region of $15,000 per ES contract) in order to trade properly and to have a chance at long term survival.

This is the figure profit and loss should be calculated on... total capital.

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A food business doesn't get in a litre of milk for $1 dollar, sell it for $2 dollars and then say they are making 100% return.(unless they are idiots)

They work out all their takings subtract all their expenses get a net profit then divide it over their initial investment. That is their return. You cannot sell a biz on the last sale through the cash register. Same with trading it ain't the last good trade you did. Its the last week, months, Quarter etc.

You cannot trade Futures on minimum margin. You need 10 to 20 times minimum margin to run this business. If they had their customers best interest in mind they would tell them this. They would not EVER quote return on minimum margin. But they haven't got their customers best interest in mind they just want to numb their brains with nice fairy tales like 50% return on margin.

Re: Traders International - Trading S&P500 Eminis

wayneL said:

Guys

Check out this TI video from Friday's trading. http://www.tradersinternational.com/recaps/2008/03/28/28.html

One of the most atrocious examples of hindsight trading I've ever seen. Anybody who's been around index futures longer than 45 seconds will see this instantly.

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AHahahahahaha!

In the first minute it looks like they skip over 5 massive losses.

Why pay 7k for someone telling you that it's at a pivot point or fib level?

And there isn't anyway to test those adequately I do not think... so they are just forking out huge bucks for a discretionary trader's entries.

So much for the proven 70% accuracy...

Re: Traders International v's PureTick for Eminis

Trembling Hand said:

Please use there correct name. Futures! If you are going to pay someone over $7000 you would at least expect they tell you the right names. Instead of some warm and fuzzy cuddly name. Futures!!!!

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What's wrong with "eminis"? It's more specific than "futures" and the name is used commonly amongst traders including the floor traders.

Re: Traders International - Trading S&P500 Eminis

Trembling Hand said:

You cannot trade Futures on minimum margin. You need 10 to 20 times minimum margin to run this business. If they had their customers best interest in mind they would tell them this. They would not EVER quote return on minimum margin. But they haven't got their customers best interest in mind they just want to numb their brains with nice fairy tales like 50% return on margin.

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This is good advice - the number of newbie traders you hear about starting with $2000 is just a joke. Being under capitalised is one of the most common reasons for blowing out an account.

Re: Traders International - Trading S&P500 Eminis

wayneL said:

Rubbish! LOL

This forum has maximum credibility exactly because we question. To question and verify is scientific.

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I totally agree with this - you can't argue with hard facts. Having said that, we should be cautious not to over-interpret the results of one person - just because an individual has good or bad results doesn't mean that the room they belong to does (although, it's probably unlikely that a room member will significantly outperform the trading room and choose to stay in the room). And it's not always easy to post live results, especially with scalp trades or short-term retracement trades - for instance, some of the Puretick trades are over within a few seconds to a few minutes. Puretick do post the trade by trade track record for each day on their website though - does anyone know if TI do that?

I think it is also valuable to get some subjective feedback about various trading rooms as well as just trading results - I'm sure people want to know what it's like being in a room and so on, not just whether the trades are good.

Similarly, the reason I first posted in this thread wasn't to post my trading results, but to let people know the reasons I chose Puretick over TI, because I thought that might be useful for others trying to decide whether to go with TI or someone else. Some of my reasons (that related to TI) were these:

1. TI has an online client testimonial video in which Peter Elsworth (he's the grey-haired Australian you see in most of the sales vids that TI have - just search for Traders International on YouTube to see those) and he is portrayed as being a client giving a testimonial in the video - which I think is very misleading on TI's part (they should at the very least delete his testimonial). I think they've made a real marketing no-no there.

2. For $7000 you get a few months membership to TI (someone please correct me if I'm wrong there), whereas for the same amount of money I'm getting 20 months worth of membership to Puretick, plus Puretick gives me the chance to join their 'alumni' and pay almost zero subscription fee once I have had two consecutive months of profitable trading results, which I really like.

I hope that information is useful in helping people decide whether TI is the sort of operator they want to deal with.

Re: Traders International - Trading S&P500 Eminis

Switching the guru voice off, was much easier to take,
There were some great opportunity's to take trades, but not using some divergence, or indicator...did you spot the little bear trap?
I don't know for sure (i don't know that many pro traders), but, i don't think an experienced trader would be using such "indicators" to trade.
The only reason he or she would use indicators is to create a mechanical "system" a new trader can follow blindly, so it can be flogged as a "system".
Entry might be precise enough, but if you use the same indicator for an exit
then you'll miss 3/4 or worst of a given move, just my opinion.

Re: Traders International v's PureTick for Eminis

Rockhoundnz said:

What's wrong with "eminis"? It's more specific than "futures" and the name is used commonly amongst traders including the floor traders.

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No its not. Tell me whats the difference between Futures contracts and your "eminis"??

What floor traders?? the only futures exchange that still has trading pits is NYBOT & a couple on the CME. I don't see what you mean about "floor traders" what have they to do with anything? They account for a tiny portion of futures contracts. And are mostly covering Agriculture.

Traders International FX

Is anyone on ASF signed up with Traders International and following their supposedly highly successful FX trading room with Erica Villalon?

Big claims of around 6000 pips since September last year. I know there is plenty of negativity on their emini programs and previous incarnations.

Funnily enough though no-one that i can find in my extensive 'google' searches is raving about their latest success.

Curiousity is killing me though.... someone? anyone?

Thanks

Selecta

Re: Traders International FX

Selecta said:

Funnily enough though no-one that i can find in my extensive 'google' searches is raving about their latest success.

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that should say quite a bit then shouldn't it!



Have moved this into the existing TI thread

Re: Traders International - Trading S&P500 Eminis

Just on this mob, I cam across this site discussing Traders International today:

http://www.tradersnarrative.com/caveat-venditor-117.html

An interesting bit of drama played out a few days ago inside the EliteTrader messageboard. After becoming a paid sponsor, Traders International started posting about their star trading teacher Franz Shoar (Faramarz Vahdatshoar).

At TI, Franz, was supposedly trading the spoos live, and pulled in hundreds of thousands of dollars a day on average. For a fee, he was willing to teach anyone by letting them look over his shoulder.

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We were told not soon after that yes, Franz was on a simulator. Those dollars that he was throwing around were just digits dancing on the monitor and were not really in play.

Next thing we know, Franz “retired”, due to bad health; TI’s website was overhauled and all mentions of Franz excised and the threads on ET were also erased.

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Re: Traders International FX

Selecta said:

Curiousity is killing me though.... someone? anyone?

Thanks

Selecta

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TI method is ultra scalping taking signals from divergence of price to MACD and Stoch. Most of the time, it doesnt work, especially during trend days.
Almost all of the followers (students) blow their aacounts within 3 months of tutoring. They are like Lemmings blindly following their leader to the abyss.
Better off giving your $7000 to charity, or go to the casino you have better odds of winning.

I'd almost forgotten about TI but went back to their site recently to look at the results....horrible couple of months on the FX by the looks of it. No wonder they haven't called me recently......

Selecta

Guy I know just told me himself buying a $5k course with Traders International and now he is a "Futures Trader" trading $10 a tick.

My stomach sank when he told me how much he'd forked out.

Is he onto a ridgy didge organisation here that's going to help him in the long run, or is he in a holding pattern in the beginners cycle?

RazzaDazzla said:

Is he onto a ridgy didge organisation here that's going to help him in the long run, or is he in a holding pattern in the beginners cycle?

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I would suggest the latter, but hey, live and learn.

Timmy said:

I would suggest the latter, but hey, live and learn.

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I suspected that may be the case.