The GFC Continues... Read On

SmellyTerror said:

I will answer with a movie quote:

It ain't the same ****in' ballpark, it ain't the same league, it ain't even the same ****in' sport.

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Greed is greed
To think we could never achieve the same amount is naive. Look at the batts scheme and how many people ripped that off and actually killed people. I know it’s not the banks, but give people enough rope and they will hang themselves for a buck.

If you think the chicken-ante fudging of the Australian banks comes anywhere near the allegations being levelled at US industry and government in the article, then... Well, I'm not sure what to say. Read it again?

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And actually, re: batts scheme, that industry was always shonky, and the (idiotic) injection of cash actually apparently made it SAFER.

Before the scheme: average of 85 fires per year coming from 65000 insulation installs. That's one fire for every 765 installs.

From the scheme there were 1.21 million installs, and 197 fires. That's only one fire for every 6142 installs.

The difference was that the states (the folk actually responsible for workplace health and safety) crapped themselves when the dump-truck of money got thrown to a bunch of shonks, and the finally introduced some regulation.

...regulation is also the difference between Oz and the US banking systems, far as I can see. 'Course, that opinion is formed entirely from hearing muppets on TV say those words, and whenever they say something I actually know anything about, they're wrong....

So /shrug, I guess.

nukz said:

http://www.smh.com.au/business/bank-debt-collectors-seizing-cash-illegally-20100913-159bj.html

http://www.smh.com.au/business/debt-collector-reveals-harassment-techniques-20100914-15axg.html

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/05/26/2909648.htm

http://www.debtcollectionletter.com.au/uncategorized/anz-debt-collectors-caught-out/

http://www.investsmart.com.au/news/news.asp?Action=Display&DocID=AGE100914QM6JDCHSIEQ

http://www.liquidationdirect.com.au/blog/general/bank-debt-collectors-seizing-cash-illegally/

Hopefully this will assist you Julia.

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Thank you for the links. Wouldn't it have been simpler to have just included these with your original assertion?
The allegations against ANZ do sound, um, as though they are being less than understanding. However, let's remember they are running a business and are entitled to follow up bad debts. We are only hearing one side of the story. Isn't it likely the customers concerned are serial defaulters, perhaps?

And it rather sounds as though (from my quick skimming of the articles) the shonky behaviour is due to the unpleasant and overzealous attitudes of some individuals than necessarily overall bank policy.

It was actually ANZ and NAB, it was not conveniantly forgotten now lets get to you Julia since your possibly a ANZ employee.. ohh wait a second thats a assumption just like you made

See what i did there?

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Sorry to disappoint you, but I'm not employed by anyone. I support myself.
I have no interest especially in ANZ and do not even own any of their shares.

I'm just opposed to unsupported allegations being posted on the internet, especially such as:

use debt collectors who constantly call up debtor's and make threats to expose the financial situation of the individuals to family, friends ect.

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I didn't see any reference in any of your links to what effectively would be blackmail, so are you not rather stretching your bank bashing here?

SmellyTerror said:

If you think the chicken-ante fudging of the Australian banks comes anywhere near the allegations being levelled at US industry and government in the article, then... Well, I'm not sure what to say. Read it again?

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You're doing a great job of missing Nukz's point. Things are OK atm in Australia but if begins to go downhill then morals/business principles could very well go out the window ala what has occured in the US. I don't think Nutz is saying that it will happen here only that we as a society should keep a very critical eye on institutions likely to act erroneously if they have over extended themselves.

financialdonk said:

You're doing a great job of missing Nukz's point. Things are OK atm in Australia but if begins to go downhill then morals/business principles could very well go out the window ala what has occured in the US. I don't think Nutz is saying that it will happen here only that we as a society should keep a very critical eye on institutions likely to act erroneously if they have over extended themselves.

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1. He said: "This practise is to some extent already being used by ANZ ..."

He has continued to defend that position - but his examples are of them doing stuff that is not remotely similar to the systematic fraud that the article is discussing.

2. I argue that it cannot happen here because we have far tighter regulation, and our political and legal systems are not remotely as corrupt (assuming the allegations levelled in the article are true).

I put zero weight on morals when it comes to corporate behaviour. People who think companies (in general, at least) would baulk at profitable behaviour that was immoral, without legislation and oversight to prevent them, are living in a fairy tale land where the economy is driven by the rainbows that come from unicorns' backsides.

If it has not happened here, it is because it can't. If our mob could get away with such blatant fraud, they would. Now. Today.

If they haven't - and I see no evidence that they have - it is because they cannot. This will not change unless Australia engages in massive deregulation, as well as fundamental changes in the way our legal system operates.