Value Collector
Have courage, and be kind.
- Joined
- 13 January 2014
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There's always a catch isn't there. I've extracted this list of "materials used for commercially available cells" from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_battery#Materials_of_commercial_cells
Positive electrode
Lithium Nickel Manganese Cobalt Oxide ("NMC", LiNixMnyCozO2)
Lithium Manganese Oxide ("LMO", LiMn2O4)
Lithium Iron Phosphate ("LFP", LiFePO4)
Negative electrode
Graphite
Lithium Titanate ("LTO", Li4Ti5O12)
Hard carbon
Tin/Cobalt Alloy
Silicon/Carbon
Anyone know how far we are from Peak any of that lot? Or what other materials might be used for lithium/ion technology? Or the status of newer technologies?
The new bhp spin off south 32 produces manganese, and nickel. Bhp produces the copper and the steel.
Does anyone know a lithium producer on the asx
I see a future where we still have centralised generation and we still have a grid, but the smaller loads take care of themselves. The grid will supply factories, CBD offices, trains, electric car charging stations and so on but a home in the suburbs it won't be needed in most parts of Australia.
As one scenario, you live in a typical suburban house, you have solar and are off-grid (because the grid was turned off in your street a few years earlier). You have an all-electric car and another plug-in hybrid car. Where the interface occurs is via the vehicles. Surplus power at home? No problem, you charge the car with it. Running low on power at home? No problem, you dump some energy out of the car's battery into your house battery. Need to buy some power? No problem, that's what your local "service station" is for - you drive there, charge the car with power from the grid and either use that power to run the car or, if necessary, dump some into your home system.
Under that scenario, there's still a grid and you can still access it but not directly. Service stations won't be routinely busy in Summer but they'll be busy places when there's a few days of cloud.
O Wow!! I've been failing to make any sense of discussions about cost of power for YEARS, largely (I think) because it's so often unclear whether cost means cost to generator, cost to consumer, or cost to intermediary. Smurf, would you care to comment on either or both of these two articles:Something I'll just add is that all this off-grid solar stuff is, in an economic sense, far more about the grid as such than it is about energy production.
<SNIP>
The financial attractiveness of solar is largely about avoiding network (grid) costs in the first place. The value of the actual power generated is comparatively minor with conventional coal / gas / hydro still far cheaper than solar on an energy only basis.
Perhaps there's another system where these Powerwall's can be replaced like LPG cylinders. If you run out of power at home, just go to the local service station for a swap-n-go.
+1This feels like the week IBM released its first personal computer: geekery flipping over to routinely ubiquitous (well, as we understood ubiquity back then). Powerwall is a lot more elegant than the PC though
I doubt if purely electric cars will be much more than a curiosity for a while due to "range fear", diesel/electric hybrids seem much more practical.
Tesla has quelled that fear a bit in the USA by building their super charge network, also the batteries are getting better.
Did you what the video of the automated battery swap? they did two vehicles in the time it takes to fill a take of petrol.
I linked the battery swap station video above, but here is the free super charger station.
Tesla has quelled that fear a bit in the USA by building their super charge network, also the batteries are getting better.
Did you what the video of the automated battery swap? they did two vehicles in the time it takes to fill a take of petrol.
I linked the battery swap station video above, but here is the free super charger station.
The development of their autopilot program on the Tesla S is pretty cool too. In a few years you'll be able to drive to where you want to go then program your car to go and find a car spot, then when you're ready get your to come pick you up. There's a pretty good head of steam built up now in the whole renewable space and I reckon we're at a point of inflexion where use of electric cars and renewables will rapidly accelerate.
Who needs Uber!
O Wow!! I've been failing to make any sense of discussions about cost of power for YEARS, largely (I think) because it's so often unclear whether cost means cost to generator, cost to consumer, or cost to intermediary.
Trading electricity at home would really be no different overall, although you'd (1) presumably take transmission and distribution constraints into account far more than is relevant at the bulk wholesale level and (2) would need to automate the process to have any real chance of making money - electricity prices are volatile way beyond what happens in any other market with huge price swings happening just about every day and sometimes several times a day
The development of their autopilot program on the Tesla S is pretty cool too. In a few years you'll be able to drive to where you want to go then program your car to go and find a car spot, then when you're ready get your to come pick you up.
Yeah, very cool indeed, Elon is doing a great job at pushing the boundaries of technology at both Tesla and space ex.
I have no idea how to value Telsa as a Business, but it is certainly great to watch.
I like the Tesla Model X that's coming out. It would suit my needs perfectly, especially if Tesla build their planned super charge network between Brisbane and Melbourne.
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