NBN Rollout Scrapped

[medicowallet]

Ahh, the copper phone network. It was the death of society as we knew it. It enabled:

1) People to download pr0n
2) People to pirate music and videos
3) People to consume stuff they don't need via the internet
4) Scammers to con people out of money
5) Women to gossip while they sat at home
6) Criminals to plan robberies


Let's get rid of it.

I see a country in debt, spending $50 billion on a depreciating asset which increases consumption greater than productivity or exports.

I can see ports and rail bottlenecking our export capacity, and leading to inefficiencies.

Why do we need fibre when copper does the job... before copper, as you have pointed out, there was not the ability to do it. Now, at the moment, clearly we have all that we require to do that job adequately, until we can support productive industries to generate the revenue to allow us to pay for playthings without going into debt to do so.

MW

PS my very large business was run like this until I sold it. It made a lot more money that way, enabling me to do things with the money generated.... the NBN is like having a Ferrari as a delivery vehicle for a lolly store, where a Toyota echo would do.

Both make the same money for you, one costs you a lot more..

 

[Smurf1976]

The NBN is not really comparable to changing from gas lights to electric lights since that represents a major change of the actual technology in use.

I'd argue that the NBN is however directly comparable to what happened in the electricity industry itself after it had been around a couple of decades. That is, the setting up of the SECV, HEC, ETSA, SECWA so on which represented:

1. A move from a small scale, somewhat "ad hoc" supply to a planned supply made available from a single network to the vast majority of the state's population.

2. A major scaling up of the overall industry. We went from small power stations on the corner of city streets and in the suburbs to massive scale operations and what can only be considered as extreme measures in a physical sense were taken to achieve this in Tas and Vic especially.

3. The NBN is a "light" form of nationalisation and represents practically the only thing of significance to actually be nationalised in the past few decades. The electricity authorities were more "full on" in that regard, but it's a similar basic model being applied.

4. In both cases it represents government stepping in where private enterprise has messed it up. Electricity was troublesome under private ownership, and the move to public ownership in Tas and Vic ultimately forced the other states to do the same. Telstra's existing infrastructure is falling apart. That's the real problem and to be blunt, it's no surprise when you have for-profit ownership of something that is "out of sight, out of mind". They profit mine it then leave someone else to pick up the cost. No surprises there.

 

[sptrawler]

Re: NBN support rises to 73 percent of Australians

Good to see I'm not alone.....

NBN support rises to 73 percent of Australians

http://delimiter.com.au/2013/03/18/nbn-support-rises-to-73-percent-of-australians/

Yes and most of them would rather drive to work in a Porsche than a Focus, especialy if you tell them it will cost them nothing.

 

[So_Cynical]

Yeh, forgot to mention, now we know why So_Cynical wants us to spend $50B of tax dollars on high speed internet.
Well at least it's not pr0n.LOL
Why spend the money on a food bowl in the North of Australia, when you can do it in 'Simcity'.
I wonder why we bother?:1zhelp:

In 2011 global game market revenue was over $65 billion, what ever you think about gaming the fact is that there is some serious money in the industry, its not kids stuff any more.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/06/06/us-videogames-factbox-idUKTRE75552I20110606

 

[sptrawler]

In 2011 global game market revenue was over $65 billion, what ever you think about gaming the fact is that there is some serious money in the industry, its not kids stuff any more.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/06/06/us-videogames-factbox-idUKTRE75552I20110606

How do they make that sort of money, from playing video games?

 

[drsmith]

Rollout is way way behind schedule and no doubt way way over budget... the end of this money sink cannot come soon enough...

Perhaps if the government actually sat down and made a plan, and worked out a budget and realistic goals, we wouldn't have this ridiculous money sink.

http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/political-news/conroy-wont-commit-to-nbn-target-20130319-2gde3.html

Labor can sell the dream.

The process to realise it, that's another matter.

 

[So_Cynical]

How do they make that sort of money, from playing video games?

Just 1 console the Xbox 360 has generated 56 billion in sales from 2005 to 2012, the games that run on that console would be 4 or 5 times that amount, PC's would be double or tripe that then you have the other consoles etc.

http://www.vg247.com/2012/05/30/xbox-360-hits-67-million-sales-worldwide-claims-47-market-share/

The next generation of consoles starts to be released this year...we get to do it all again...console internet gaming has only been around a little over a decade, the bandwidth and data getting used would double every 2 or 3 years.

 

[sptrawler]

Labor can sell the dream.

The process to realise it, that's another matter.

It will be very interesting when the real figures come out.

 

[Calliope]

A new poll has shown that support for Labor’s National Broadband Network project has risen over the past few months to a total of 73 percent, adding to a long-term trend of enduring support for the initiative demonstrated over the past several years; with even a majority of Coalition voters supporting the project

Myths, you keep on using this specious argument. For the respondents NBN equates to faster broadband service. I'm surprised the vote wasn't 100% in favour. You would get the same reply is you asked whether they would like trains running on time, or faster roads, or faster service at the checkout.

 

[So_Cynical]

If you think the NBN is expensive: compared to what?

http://www.abc.net.au/technology/articles/2013/02/14/3690222.htm

Also talk on Whirlpool that the noalitions FTTN will need 83000 cabinets to be installed. 83000 im sure that's gona save alot of money.

 

[sptrawler]

Just 1 console the Xbox 360 has generated 56 billion in sales from 2005 to 2012, the games that run on that console would be 4 or 5 times that amount, PC's would be double or tripe that then you have the other consoles etc.

http://www.vg247.com/2012/05/30/xbox-360-hits-67-million-sales-worldwide-claims-47-market-share/

The next generation of consoles starts to be released this year...we get to do it all again...console internet gaming has only been around a little over a decade, the bandwidth and data getting used would double every 2 or 3 years.

So can you explain to me how the sale of Xboxes helps me or Australia.
How does Australians paying $50B for faster internet speeds, so more people want to buy an Xbox that is made overseas, help us.
That is really crazy economics.
I can see why opening up the North, doesn't push your button.

 

[sptrawler]

NBNmyths, I posted years ago that the first casualty would be free to air t.v.
I said why the hell are we paying to put in infrastructure that is going to charge us for what we currently enjoy for free?
What about pensioners and people who don't want the internet, what will they do when free to air t.v requires an internet conection?
What about people who only want to pay for minimal download, to enjoy surfing and forums?

http://news.theage.com.au/breaking-...expensive-for-tv-networks-20130318-2gabu.html

Well that probably is collateral damage from your perspective.LOL
You should get preselection for Labor, "the party that gives you what you need, wether you want it or not".

I doubt your going to get unlimited t.v streaming on a $30 plan.
Whereas at the moment it comes free to your t.v through the antenna on the roof.
It is a bloody national disgrace, the government should put that info out to the public.
Let's see how many of your 70% would vote for it then.

 

[CanOz]

I'm a bit lost here...why would you not want high speed fibre?

 

[drsmith]

From your linked article sp,

The next generation of TV sets would be four times the resolution of current high-definition sets.

Unless they are very, very big, I'd like to know what improvement in human eyesight is on the way to make that of material use.

 

[CanOz]

Canada may be all 4G for rural internet soon....

I actually know these guys..lol

CanOz

 

[CanOz]

From your linked article sp,



Unless they are very, very big, I'd like to know what improvement in human eyesight is on the way to make that of material use.

That's probably what they said about black and white vs color lol!

CanOz

 

[sptrawler]

From your linked article sp,



Unless they are very, very big, I'd like to know what improvement in human eyesight is on the way to make that of material use.

Well doc, to fill the screen will take more download, this is going to end up like owning a boat, a hole that you throw money into.
The government will own the backbone infrastrure, therefore they will charge the user e.g chanel 7 to use the service.
Well '7' will have to pass on the cost to either the advertisers or the viewers.
At the moment only the advertisers pay, I wonder what will happen when users have to pay to watch?
We must be the dumbest people on earth.
Which is probably why Labor treat us as such.lol

By the way So_Cynical, your unlimited plan will soon be blown out of the water, when your free to air streaming is included.lol

Good old Labor to bring in the insideous by stealth.

I hope Bolt jumps on this. But he probably won't because he has skin in the game.lol

 

[sptrawler]

I see we are both viewing the same thread NBNmyths, thanks to GG.

 

[NBNMyths]

NBNmyths, I posted years ago that the first casualty would be free to air t.v.
I said why the hell are we paying to put in infrastructure that is going to charge us for what we currently enjoy for free?
What about pensioners and people who don't want the internet, what will they do when free to air t.v requires an internet conection?
What about people who only want to pay for minimal download, to enjoy surfing and forums?

http://news.theage.com.au/breaking-...expensive-for-tv-networks-20130318-2gabu.html

Well that probably is collateral damage from your perspective.LOL
You should get preselection for Labor, "the party that gives you what you need, wether you want it or not".

I doubt your going to get unlimited t.v streaming on a $30 plan.
Whereas at the moment it comes free to your t.v through the antenna on the roof.
It is a bloody national disgrace, the government should put that info out to the public.
Let's see how many of your 70% would vote for it then.

What a bizarre series of arguments....

Who would have thought that the owner of a TV station would want free access to the network. I guess he's not thinking of himself at all.

There is no proposal, plan or discussion to dump the currently transmitted 576/1080 HDTV broadcasts. You will still get TV free via the antenna on your roof. But if you want 4K TV then the only practical way to deliver it would be via a fibre network. However, if you scale back the NBN to FTTN, then you can't deliver 4KTV to most people at all.

So are you saying we're better off with nobody getting 4KTV, rather than offer them the option of getting it as part of their monthly internet subscription if they want something better than standard HDTV?

The whole 4K TV thing is completely undecided anyway. There are a lot of issues:

None of the current stations have any plans to broadcast it;
It wouldn't be feasible over the NBN wireless/sat portions, so areas covered by regional stations would either miss out or need a dedicated satellite or terrestrial broadcast system anyway;
The NBN have announced multicast pricing, and it's pretty cheap. It would cost TV stations $250 per month for up to 100Mbps total (enough for about 5 4KTV streams). It would cost consumers about $5 per month for each channel. Maybe Kerry can't spare $250 per month, I don't know.

 

[sptrawler]

What a bizarre series of arguments....

Who would have thought that the owner of a TV station would want free access to the network. I guess he's not thinking of himself at all.

There is no proposal, plan or discussion to dump the currently transmitted 576/1080 HDTV broadcasts. You will still get TV free via the antenna on your roof. But if you want 4K TV then the only practical way to deliver it would be via a fibre network. However, if you scale back the NBN to FTTN, then you can't deliver 4KTV to most people at all.

So are you saying we're better off with nobody getting 4KTV, rather than offer them the option of getting it as part of their monthly internet subscription if they want something better than standard HDTV?

The whole 4K TV thing is completely undecided anyway. There are a lot of issues:

None of the current stations have any plans to broadcast it;
It wouldn't be feasible over the NBN wireless/sat portions, so areas covered by regional stations would either miss out or need a dedicated satellite or terrestrial broadcast system anyway;
The NBN have announced multicast pricing, and it's pretty cheap. It would cost TV stations $250 per month for up to 100Mbps total (enough for about 5 4KTV streams). It would cost consumers about $5 per month for each channel. Maybe Kerry can't spare $250 per month, I don't know.

Oh the answer is if you want 4KTV, who the hell knows what that is?
But I can see I have put you into hyperdrive.
So what if free to air radio goes to DAB over the NBN? How does that reflect on free to air radio?
Do you need an internetconnection to get radio transmitted through the NBN?
I can see why they would want to get rural Australia hooked up first, they will complain the most, because of lack of options.lol