Navy boys do as they do

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,25733571-421,00.html

I have never been in favour of females sailing on Australian Navy ships.

And this "episode" confirms my ideas.

There is a conflict between normal human sexual urges and sexual harassment, and the Navy ain't going to achieve it by sending hundreds of young males and females on a ship for six months at a time.

Wake up Navy.

Wake up ADF.

Ladies are ladies and fighters are fighters. And sometimes ladies don't behave like ladies, and fighters likewise.

gg

Re: Navy boys do as they do.

Yes, an issue through the entire Defence Force really.

And why there is still some argument to not allow homosexuals in also.

Very non PC, but Defence is not like going to work 9-5 in an office block in Collins St.

And the ship example takes the cake.

Re: Navy boys do as they do.

G'Day GG,

Garpal Gumnut said:

I have never been in favour of females sailing on Australian Navy ships.gg

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Hmmm.. Why so?? In this age of equality, why not?? I can tell you from experience that some blokes detested the idea, but that was generally 'cause it was a change, and they simply hated change.. From my point of view, I was happy as the day they announced that females would be allowed to serve at sea (and in fact if they joined after a certain date it was mandatory) I understood that my sea time would be reduced and I would be able to enjoy more time at home with my family, as the 'pool' of replacements for my billet had almost doubled.. Gotta be happy with that.

Also, why 'recruit' and train personnel that would never actually 'serve'.. if a person never has to go to sea and serve on a warship, why enlist them in the Navy?? Why not just employ a civilian to do the job, and save a few dollars??

Garpal Gumnut said:

And this "episode" confirms my ideas.

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This is not an episode, this is just Jack being Jack.. before having females at sea we used to have VD stakes.. Unsavory at it may seem, books were run on who would squeeze up first (squeeze up means contract a venereal disease, I'll spare you the graphic details of the term!!)

Garpal Gumnut said:

There is a conflict between normal human sexual urges and sexual harassment, and the Navy ain't going to achieve it by sending hundreds of young males and females on a ship for six months at a time.

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No conflict either. The average age on most Warships is between 18 and 22, you put a bunch of [Male & Female] sailors of that age on a tin can that bobs around the ocean for weeks at a time, you know they will discover that their body parts are compatible, and fluids will be swapped.. Only a fool would not accept that. However, fraternisation rules are in place to deter 'blatant' displays of affection, and to allow the hierarchy to hang someone if all goes pear shaped.. A mutual encounter in the CHT room or Magazine Service Room is very different to sexual harassment. Also, don't for a minute think this is something (as in this particular report) that only the male sailors do, the girlies have many a game too..

Garpal Gumnut said:

Wake up Navy.

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Haha.. They are very much awake mate, they just tend to turn a blind eye to the majority of it.. This story only got out because there was something significantly larger behind it.. what that is I don't know, and I'd tip we probably never will, but there is some serious ass covering going on, and as usual it is the 'juniors' that will end up wearing the brunt..

Cheers,

Buster

Totally to be expected and the PC nazi's should either put up or shut up. They want woman to be placed in harms way (war and/or preparing for war) amongst a lot of young males where natures base instincts rule. Rape is not on the card but surely seduction and laying odds is not a crime. @#$% sake.

From what I understand some of my ex-Navy mate apart from passing on soggy sao stories tell of voracious female crew appetites in the sex department. Seriously the whole thing is stupid.

Lets not assume that the women in the Defence Force aren't unhappy about the smorgasboard on offer. Or the high proportion of lesbians. It's a win win.

kennas said:

Lets not assume that the women in the Defence Force aren't unhappy about the smorgasboard on offer. Or the high proportion of lesbians. It's a win win.

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I have no Navy experience but spent some time in the Army.

My impressions of the Navy when I met them on joint exercises were that they were an anxious bunch, up themselves and suffered the following.

Gender anxiety. Homosexuality was rife particularly in the upper eschelons,
male and female.

Alcoholism They seemed to go into battle pissed.
The Army got pissed after battle.

Marching They couldn't march to save themselves and thus I felt
that in an emergency they would fold, no discipline.


gg

I've never been in the Navy but it's much the same in any situation with a high proportion of males 18 - 25 and very few females.

Factories, workshops, warehouses etc all much the same, there's always someone who's a bit sex obsessed (probably because they're not getting anywhere near as much as they claim) and thinks of nothing else and they tend to encourage the rest via their bragging.

Better sex than drugs or dangerous driving in my opinion. Group think is very much what happens in those situations and to be honest I'd much rather have it focused on sex and/or drinking to excess on Saturday night than on driving at ridiculous speeds on public streets, injecting drugs or anything like that. At least there's some chance of it all working out OK.

And the problem is? We expect them to go and serve Queen and Country and BLOW the heads off our enemies but they can't root their way around the high seas? Bit of a farce really. Are we not talking about ADULTS here. Have any of the women cried FOUL/RAPE/WOLF? I have a vague recollection (nightclub in Darwin called Fanny's) that some of the women are sexual predators (afterall I am married) and consider it a notch on their belt, similar to the accepted ethos of men.

It is easy to see why the Navy has such difficulty in recruiting enough men to man their ships.

There is a strong anti-male culture in the Navy hierarchy. On a visit to Flinders Naval depot a few years age, I saw posters on notice boards advising women of their rights and exhorting them to report any improper advances made to them. This gives the females a powerful weapon.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,25733571-421,00.html

The individuals were removed from the ship after an equity and diversity health check, which led to a formal inquiry being initiated.

”During the equity and diversity health check a number of concerns were raised by female crew members. These concerns are now subject to formal inquiry.”

The statement said the navy demands a working environment “free from unacceptable behaviour”.

It warns all of its staff to “treat others fairly” and that any form of unacceptable behaviour “will be dealt with”.

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What's an "equity and diversity health check" for godsake?

I agree with Buster - well said

As long as no one is bullied or sexually harrassed, be it male or female -- then no big deal, they are adults..

The reason its probably in the news is coz they want us the public to get upset about it
- taxpayers dollars paying for them to have a good time?

but then, for them to be taken off the ship, its has to be alot more than just that...

GG, they probably say the same thing about the Army guys and gals..

Aww come on, they look so cute in those uniforms lol - bell bottoms haha

I believe the Navy bought this manual from the Irish Dept. of Health.

It is called a Health and Diversity Check.

No wonder the Irish are going broke.

It has nothing to do with folk bending over.

The bloke who developed it is a professor at Trinity College Dublin called Benedict Dover.

www.equal-ci.ie/download/healthcheck-manual05.pdf

gg

Thanks gg. What a crock. Apparently the Navy employs people to audit these things and encourage people to dob in those they don't like, or want to get even with.

We have Prude Gow on the case so it will all be sorted quickly...She know about discrimination and is proud to use it.

I've always wondered in this feminist age, if & when war comes, will women get conscripted, fight & die just like men? I reckon this would be the true test of equality in the armed forces & respect would thus be earned.

Cheers

Buckeroo said:

I've always wondered in this feminist age, if & when war comes, will women get conscripted, fight & die just like men? I reckon this would be the true test of equality in the armed forces & respect would thus be earned.

Cheers

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They would be OK in the Navy. I don't think the Navy has faced a shot fired in anger since WW 2.

Why are Navy Guys singled out as being so bad?
They are just people doing a job under difficult circumstances. Do you really think that other occupations don't have similar problems.
The female sailors were also participating, it's just that their activities weren't compared amongst themselves and documented.
If "The Ledger" wasn't maintained, there would be no complaints. Was someone embarrassed to be caught out in the ledger?
We need these people, and it is hard enough to recruit new sailors now.
Let them do their job.

The media loves a story, particularly after they exaggerate it, and the Navy has to keep face with the pc crowd. It's probably more outrageous if only one sex commits the action, and males will probably provoke more outrage than females, ironically for sexist reasons (the view that males are predators, stronger, females being the 'fairer' sex etc). When was the last time you heard about the gang-rape of a male by females?

Julia Gillard has spoken, so listen up hello sailors.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/07/05/2617202.htm?section=australia

gg

Garpal Gumnut said:

My impressions of the Navy when I met them on joint exercises were that they were an anxious bunch, up themselves and suffered the following.


Gender anxiety. Homosexuality was rife particularly in the upper eschelons,
male and female.

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LOL.. perhaps you need to pull one the annual defence attitude surveys from the last number of years.. You'll find that homosexuals rank highest in the RAAF, followed by ARMY then Navy.. but lets not have any awkward facts get in the way..

Garpal Gumnut said:

Alcoholism They seemed to go into battle pissed.
The Army got pissed after battle.

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Sounds like a better option to me.. Unfortunately in this day and age, beer issues are very few and far between though..

Garpal Gumnut said:

Marching They couldn't march to save themselves and thus I felt
that in an emergency they would fold, no discipline.

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You're right we can't march for sheite.. Folding through lack of disipline because we cant march in a straight line?? LOL, I'm tipping you didn't spend much time thinking this point through, if you had you may have come to the conclusion that we really have no cause to..

We don't fill our days marching from point A to point B like the pongos, that is the beauty of having a Ship at your disposal.. Far better to concentrate on trivial matters like damage control in order to keep it afloat in case of a hit.. could think of nothing worse that trying to sleep on a wet mattress..

Regards,

Buster

Maybe not appropriate but......oh well.....