I am having a blonde moment.....

[Prospector]

OK, here's the story. I bought some shares at around 90 cents, then this share went crazy for about 2 weeks due to some market manipulation and potentially innaccurate market announcements.

(Choccy frog to those who have now worked out it is AUM/CDU! : )

So I bought some more of these shares at the higher price (around $5). The share price rose to $10 then kerpow - trading halt for days and days.

I have not held any of these shares for more than 12 months, but both lots were bought through a Company structure - CGT always 30%, and a Super Fund CGT 15% - 10% after 12 months.

So I decided I would sell some for, unfortunately, around $2.30. I was OS at the time and probably shouldnt even have checked the portfolio, but that pesky trading halt happened just before I left.

So I have either made a very large CG, or a large CL - depending on which parcel of shares I nominate to sell.

Am I better of realising the Gain, or crystallising the loss? Or, in reverse, see the value of my portfolio, esp Super Fund, increase if I sell for the loss!

My accountant thinks I trade too much anyway so wont even bother asking him the question! He probably doesnt even know you can know choose which parcel to sell

 

[tech/a]

P

I personally keep both trades seperate if I have pyramided into a trade.
If the original is still within the trading parameters I first allocated then I would keep it.

If the second fell to a loss position and in your case due to massive slippage a large loss then it would need to be a decision based upon such factors as those mentioned.
You will need to do the maths.

One question I would ask though with regard to holding the second purchase any longer is---would I buy them today!

The decision is made more complex only due to the slippage.
If no slippage it would be for me at least purely based upon my trading methodology however at times we need to analyse our decisions.

I say this as once I sold a whole portfolio before an extended trip and 10 mins after selling realised that 2 large long held positions would be taxed at 50% where another 6 weeks and they were 25%----And I'm NOT BLOND!!!

 

[Rafa]

i always take the losses first, regardless.

If you can hold onto the profit making shares for > 12 months, that is an added bonus.

 

[Stinger]

I agree, i would definately take the loss. This can then be offset against any gains at year end and if you hold onto the gain making shares for 12 months can access the 33% discount for the shares held in the super fund.

 

[Julia]

I'd take the loss, Prospector. Btw, I hope you're joking when you suggest your accountant wouldn't know you can choose which parcel to sell????

Julia

 

[Realist]

If I was you I'd take the loss, slap myself for being so silly, sack the accountant, and consider selling the rest of my CDU shares today as over $4.10 is a good price currently for what is alot of hype and not too much substance.

 

[Freeballinginawetsuit]

If I was you I'd take the loss, slap myself for being so silly, sack the accountant, and consider selling the rest of my CDU shares today as over $4.10 is a good price currently for what is alot of hype and not too much substance.

Enough substance to hold at approx $3.00 for the last few months, from an SP of 30c.

 

[NettAssets]

The forum has CDU sussed

the "similar threads" down the bottom only lists one...

The ASF Joke Thread!

 

[Realist]

Enough substance to hold at approx $3.00 for the last few months, from an SP of 30c.

Substance or hype?

Can someone please explain to me why CDU is worth $260M while CQT is worth $60M?

Is it because CDU hypes it announcements and the directors profit from them while CQT are conservative and realistic in their estimates?

 

[Freeballinginawetsuit]

The forum has CDU sussed

the "similar threads" down the bottom only lists one...

The ASF Joke Thread!

Serious money has been made on CDU/AUM by traders. Who cares if its on the Joke thread, the forum probably hasn't traded it so the next best thing is to joke about it. CDU is volitile and has volume.

Personally I think it a donkey fundamentally, but that wouldn't stop me short trading it.

 

[NettAssets]

I should have stayed long - I bailed at 404

NA

 

[Freeballinginawetsuit]

I should have stayed long - I bailed at 404

NA

Once long and twice in and out on the three lollipop days. Its a donkey, but a nice one to spank!

 

[dubiousinfo]

Substance or hype?

Can someone please explain to me why CDU is worth $260M while CQT is worth $60M?

Is it because CDU hypes it announcements and the directors profit from them while CQT are conservative and realistic in their estimates?

At a SP of $4.00 CDU has a cap of $400mil fully diluted.

CQT at a price of .42c has a cap of $95mil fully diluted.

 

[Freeballinginawetsuit]

At a SP of $4.00 CDU has a cap of $400mil fully diluted.

CQT at a price of .42c has a cap of $95mil fully diluted.

Its SP has been all over the place. How could you place a firm market cap on it. Maybe thats Realists point?

 

[Realist]

Its SP has been all over the place. How could you place a firm market cap on it. Maybe thats Realists point?

Nah it wasnt my point exactly, my point was - how can CDU be worth $400M today?

It seems ridiculous to me. Based on what facts is it worth this much?

 

[dubiousinfo]

Its SP has been all over the place. How could you place a firm market cap on it. Maybe thats Realists point?

No don't think that was his point. He was asking why people were willing to value CDU at figure so much higher than CQT. I think he was impying that CDU was not that much better than CQT. I only posted the figures because realist was using undiluted figures.

Market cap is always shares x price & as the SP is not static neither is the market cap. Its just a way of assessing what you are paying at a given SP i.e. what it would cost to buy the whole company at a particular SP.

I know it's easy to lose sight of it when you are short term trading, but you are in effect buying part of a company.

 

[Freeballinginawetsuit]

No don't think that was his point. He was asking why people were willing to value CDU at figure so much higher than CQT. I think he was impying that CDU was not that much better than CQT. I only posted the figures because realist was using undiluted figures.

Market cap is always shares x price & as the SP is not static neither is the market cap. Its just a way of assessing what you are paying at a given SP i.e. what it would cost to buy the whole company at a particular SP.

I know it's easy to lose sight of it when you are short term trading, but you are in effect buying part of a company.

?, of course.

I was trying to make the point that Realists cap on his company is realistic. CDU dosent have a realistic cap ( although has recently found some stability at $3).

The point was that CDU is ramped, it could go back to 40c or up to neverland.
Furthermore it is a stock to short trade and only hold long when it has a few more fundamentals, so I don't consider its market cap relevant.

Its a Specky with a $4 SP, but then again so was FMG not so long ago.

 

[Prospector]

I'd take the loss, Prospector. Btw, I hope you're joking when you suggest your accountant wouldn't know you can choose which parcel to sell????

Julia

I know you want me to say I was joking, maybe I will just test him out
Because I really think he might not! Will let you know what he says!

Thanks for all the advice people, seems like a loss might be the way to go. However, if I dont have any other CG this year (ie dont sell any more shares!), I might take it as a Gain, just in case the accountant sees it as an opportunity to give me some (more) grief!

 

[NettAssets]

I might take it as a Gain, just in case the accountant sees it as an opportunity to give me some (more) grief!

Losses you can carry forward
Gains you are stuck with

John

My accountants advice to me!
Mind you I had had a good year

 

[Realist]

Losses you can carry forward
Gains you are stuck with

And that is the key point.

Also the taxes on losses are fixed, on gains they halve after 1 year.

Take losses, hold gains!!