Flood Levy - Do you agree?

[Liar's Poker]

Just to clarify, I have no problem with having my money going to a cause. Ever since I earn't my first dollar, I have always donated a percentage of my salary to charity.

My problem with the levy, is the way it is being applied.

The levy is un-Australian.

Australia is a country where people have a high degree of freedom and choice. It is Australian to donate out of the goodness of your heart.

If I was sent a letter that asked if I wanted to participate, I would agree to - give people a choice to participate, to feel proud that they have contributed to a worthy cause. Don't just take away peoples right to make a decision.

Or at least let me choose where a portion of it goes so I feel a sense of ownership. For me, I would much rather have my levy go to the WSPCA.

I will be extremely dissapointed if my levy contributes to rebuilding on-grade housing next to rivers or flood plains. I can deal with tax, I can't deal with ignorance.



-Liar-

 

[tothemax6]

How do you propose to fix the government built / controlled infrastructure damage then.........

That doesn't even make sense. You are implying that the governments expenditure is fixed and efficient, that they tax precisely this much to pay for it, and that the floods have disrupted the expenditure towards the upside. Clearly wrong. The government splurges money randomly on its various wasteful projects, and the spending frenzy (for which we have nothing to show) following the GFC was case in point.

They could privatize more, they could spend less on wasteful government projects, they could have retained the surplus. If you legitimize increased government tax, you give them moral sanction to ever-increase their spending, and in turn then saying 'we need more taxation to cover the bill'.

 

[Sean K]

I don't quite understand how they have come to a $$ figure so quickly. How do they really know how much the public infrastructure rebuilding is going to cost? When Victorias floods haven't even subsided? And the Gov does have a slush fund for these types of events around $5b I believe. Maybe that's paying for the War...

I am very happy to chip in, but I would have liked to have seen them wait and count the costs a little better to determine what's really required.

And I don't quite understand the $1.9b cuts in climate initiatives. The greatest crisis of our generation, or whatever, caused this didn't it? I'm confused...

 

[Julia]

Has anyone heard of what essential "community" infrastructure needs repair/rebuilding?

Um, weren't you looking at the nightly TV footage of roads and bridges being swept away? Schools and various other institutional buildings ruined.

 

[nulla nulla]

As far as the comments from the usual quarter about being ashamed of their fellow Australians for expressing disgust about the levy are concerned, for heaven's sake just for once acknowledge the flaws in your much loved Labor Party.

If you read on you would see my post acknowledging the faults of the labour party.

Those expressing anger at the imposition of a levy are not at all being uncharitable toward their fellow Australians, and many have already given generously, so just damn well get off your moral high horse. The continual posturing is becoming tired and tiresome.

My contempt for the tightfisted meanness displayed isn't "posturing" it is contempt. The generous donations to charities will mostly make their way to the needy people experiencing hardship. The charitable donations will not rebuild the roads, bridges, airports etc.

Can't you see that the objection is not at all about unwillingness to give to our fellow citizens, but a disgust at this political quasi solution to a government in trouble and without ideas? Meantime, they continue to dole out the middle class welfare.

I can see quite clearly the generosity of people in giving to our fellow citizens. It is something Australians are good at, locally and internationaly. Unfortunately we are also good at turning a fast track rebuilding effort into a political football for the hope of scoring a few political points. In respect of "middle class welfare". I respecfully remind you that it was Tony Abbott that wanted to introduce a levy on bussiness of 1.5% to cover his plan to provide paid maternity leave for of up to $75,000 to people on high incomes to take 12 months maternity leave.

One thing that has happened today that has made me laugh is Christine Milne's fury about the scrapping of the various Green initiatives. It's almost worth the imposition of the levy to see her so upset! Just can't stand that woman.

It will be interesting to see the extent of the greens re-action to cuts in their programs and whether they are affronted enough to bring down the government. I doubt it.

 

[nulla nulla]

Ladies and gentlemen: I have noticed some insults creeping into this thread and I do not wish to see any more. It is possible to debate issues such as this one and disagree with others without resorting to insults and personal attacks.

Thank you for your co-operation.

Noted. I will reframe from posting further in this thread. Wouldn't want to get banned for upsetting some pious, self-righteous, tightfisted posters.

 

[tigerboi]

What's the chances that it will end up being a 'one off' levy. In 12 months time we will all be used to paying the extra tax, so she will come up with some reason that it needs to be extended for another year. Then it will end up being a 'full time' tax. Just like the medicare levy. Why don't they just can the medicare levy, can the flood levy, and adjust the actual tax rates so that people know exactly what tax rate they are paying.

Even better, why don't they just delay the building of the NBN and use the funds to do their flood rebuilding.

I have an even better idea...how about stop giving $4b a year to people who hate our guts! foreign aid $4b a year we give away...should be scrapped asap & given BACK to us the people who need it...done floods all paid for with a stroke of the pen...tigerboi

 

[tech/a]

Just saw a levy poll on TV

86% NO
14% YES

This shows to me that very few Australians actually give willingly to fellow Australians in need.

There are a Large majority who wouldn't give a cent to their struggling mother!

 

[Tysonboss1]

Just saw a levy poll on TV

86% NO
14% YES

This shows to me that very few Australians actually give willingly to fellow Australians in need.

There are a Large majority who wouldn't give a cent to their struggling mother!

It's not about that. this levy is mostly for infrastructure.

It's about the government not being prepared for such situations.

I mean yes we have just had some floods, but befoe that it was bushfires, and before that a cyclone and before that more fires, floods and cyclones.

We will always have "disasters" and the government should have funding budjected for. I mean I have insurance the government should put a little aside each year as insurance rather than just spring a levy every time somthing happens.

 

[Tysonboss1]

They have wasted so much money over the last 3 years, why should we now donated extra just because the coffers are empty. Surly they need some self examination of their failure to save for a rainy day.

 

[zzaaxxss3401]

Just saw a levy poll on TV

86% NO
14% YES

This shows to me that very few Australians actually give willingly to fellow Australians in need.

There are a Large majority who wouldn't give a cent to their struggling mother!

What was the Poll:
A) Would you agree with a flood levy?
B) Would you donate (money / labour / equipment) to charity?

 

[Frank D]

This shows to me that very few Australians actually give willingly to fellow Australians in need.

There are a Large majority who wouldn't give a cent to their struggling mother!

The majority of Australians do care, that’s why we give to charity and donate our
time to good causes. We choose to do so.

But we hate when we are told by governments that we must give. (Tax)

People just don’t trust this government to implement it properly, simply because
history tells us so.

When Gillard uttered those words…. ‘This is a progressive tax’, I immediately
favoured the NO category.

 

[prawn_86]

What happened to the Future Fund set up by Peter Costello when he was Treasurer?

I thought this myself. Isn't the FF for 'nation building'? Surely this would classify.

This shows to me that very few Australians actually give willingly to fellow Australians in need.

Tech,

As others have said, its not the money, it's the principle. I have already given to charity yet now am FORCED to give more. The government should know these things are going to occur and have a slush fund saved.

What happens if there is a huge fire this summer in VIC/ SA, will they then up the levy and turn it into a permanent 'disater levy'?

What about all the irrigators in SA who didnt get any bailouts when they had to spend tens of thousands of dollars to purchase water when the government cut their allocations? Or the VIC fire victims who had to rely soley on donations and no extra tax etc etc

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

This is an Un-Australian Tax.

It is traditional for Australians to help each other willingly in disasters, via donations, help in kind, volunteering and work for no pay.

This pommy-origin PM has brought from her home country, one of the rather evil socialist principles, of forced assistance via bureaucracy.

Next she will appoint a Labor grandee such as Kaiser to oversee the Reconstruction on a salary of $750,000 pa.

What of all the donations, help and work that workers have contributed to flood victims already? then she taxes them.

She just doesn't get it.

gg

 

[Ruby]

Just saw a levy poll on TV

86% NO
14% YES

This shows to me that very few Australians actually give willingly to fellow Australians in need.

It shows no such thing. On the contrary, Australians give very generously of their time and money to others in need. What the poll does show is that people object to a levy. Nothing else.

There are a Large majority who wouldn't give a cent to their struggling mother!

Really? Have you got statistical evidence to support this rather sweeping and arrogant statement?

 

[IFocus]

Its fascinating watching the anti political, anti tax, anti Labor, anti.......well basically anything giving attitudes in the thread.

The excuse list for not paying a miserable minor amount of money is really funny the repairs to infrastructure will directly affect the economy and the well being of all Australians.

The RBA governor whats his name said the government should borrow the dough which of course is correct it has the least effect on the balances affects the economy and is more predictable.

Of course with the Wreak-er in full cry like his disciples here that's politically impossible.

Personally I think a levy and keeping the budget to a surplus 12/13 is the way to go the world is a dangerous place and we should pay as we go.

And before the hanging posse turns up screaming stimulus waste blah blah it was borrowings repeat borrowings not normal revenue for gods sake there is no pot of gold it went to the middle class welfare.

The money has to come from borrowings or tax there is no frigging money tree this would apply to any government at any time should an amount of money on this scale be required for fixing infrastructure resulting from one of the biggest natural disasters in Australia's white history.

To QLD-ers apologies for the mean spirited anti Australian attitudes expressed on the thread the aggressive nastiness dished out to Nokia and the absence of any support from others was / is particularly shame full (you mostly all failed this simple test) and really sums up many here.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

This is an Un-Australian Tax.

It is traditional for Australians to help each other willingly in disasters, via donations, help in kind, volunteering and work for no pay.

This pommy-origin PM has brought from her home country, one of the rather evil socialist principles, of forced assistance via bureaucracy.

Next she will appoint a Labor grandee such as Kaiser to oversee the Reconstruction on a salary of $750,000 pa.

What of all the donations, help and work that workers have contributed to flood victims already? then she taxes them.

She just doesn't get it.

gg

Its fascinating watching the anti political, anti tax, anti Labor, anti.......well basically anything giving attitudes in the thread.

The excuse list for not paying a miserable minor amount of money is really funny the repairs to infrastructure will directly affect the economy and the well being of all Australians.

The RBA governor whats his name said the government should borrow the dough which of course is correct it has the least effect on the balances affects the economy and is more predictable.

Of course with the Wreak-er in full cry like his disciples here that's politically impossible.

Personally I think a levy and keeping the budget to a surplus 12/13 is the way to go the world is a dangerous place and we should pay as we go.

And before the hanging posse turns up screaming stimulus waste blah blah it was borrowings repeat borrowings not normal revenue for gods sake there is no pot of gold it went to the middle class welfare.

The money has to come from borrowings or tax there is no frigging money tree this would apply to any government at any time should an amount of money on this scale be required for fixing infrastructure resulting from one of the biggest natural disasters in Australia's white history.

To QLD-ers apologies for the mean spirited anti Australian attitudes expressed on the thread the aggressive nastiness dished out to Nokia and the absence of any support from others was / is particularly shame full (you mostly all failed this simple test) and really sums up many here.

IF, I'm a Queenslander and agree that we need infrastructure spending to recover.

Its the method of collection, a one off quickfix that bothers me, the financial aptitude and the previous history of financial incompetence in delivering big ticket items by the minority Labor Federal Government.

Also the Un-Australian way of dealing with it. Volunteering and Donations will fall dramatically as a consequence of this rot.

That is the crux.

Not the few grand on tax.

gg

 

[pedalofogus]

Its fascinating watching the anti political, anti tax, anti Labor, anti.......well basically anything giving attitudes in the thread.

The excuse list for not paying a miserable minor amount of money is really funny the repairs to infrastructure will directly affect the economy and the well being of all Australians.

The RBA governor whats his name said the government should borrow the dough which of course is correct it has the least effect on the balances affects the economy and is more predictable.

Of course with the Wreak-er in full cry like his disciples here that's politically impossible.

Personally I think a levy and keeping the budget to a surplus 12/13 is the way to go the world is a dangerous place and we should pay as we go.

And before the hanging posse turns up screaming stimulus waste blah blah it was borrowings repeat borrowings not normal revenue for gods sake there is no pot of gold it went to the middle class welfare.

The money has to come from borrowings or tax there is no frigging money tree this would apply to any government at any time should an amount of money on this scale be required for fixing infrastructure resulting from one of the biggest natural disasters in Australia's white history.

To QLD-ers apologies for the mean spirited anti Australian attitudes expressed on the thread the aggressive nastiness dished out to Nokia and the absence of any support from others was / is particularly shame full (you mostly all failed this simple test) and really sums up many here.

I am against the levy, but I'm not unaustralian or against rebuilding qld or other places. I live in ipswich qld, so I know how much work is needed on infrastructures. But I don't think a levy is the way to go about it. Why not just stop some of the current infrastructure projects for a while, and use the funds to rebuild flood areas. The problem is that the government will be competing with itself to get contractors. With so many people already building those over priced school halls, there won't be anyone left to rebuild.

As normal Australians, we are expected to put aside money for a rainy day. Maybe the government should have done this rather than p***ing billions of dollars against the wall on insulation schemes and school halls. Now they need their parents to bail them out cause they spent all their pocket money

 

[sails]

Noted. I will reframe from posting further in this thread. Wouldn't want to get banned for upsetting some pious, self-righteous, tightfisted posters.

Wow, that's below the belt for people who have already been generous in their giving of both time and money. It is unbelievably rude.

However, many don't trust this government to use the levy funds in any sort of fiscally responsible manner. If history repeats, it will be another bungle added to labor's list leaving Qld waiting for infrastructure repair while a few become rich from the scheme.

IMO, the strongly negative attitude over the levy comes down to a deep distrust of this government's ability to manage anything.

 

[3DT Velocity]

The Government moans about the uninsured, isn't their infrastructure insured?

I don't mind paying a fee until the 5.9bil is covered, but neither Party has a good reputation for removing a tax once in place.

ie; Victoria with Pyramid debacle, Fuel Levy and the incoming Desalination Plant levy.

The only way the Government knows how to fix anything these days is to increase Taxes.