I dont understand, are you saying traders make the market more competitive?
--because that would add 'value' to society... and it maybe true... but in my opinion it is inconclusive.
I dont understand, are you saying traders make the market more competitive?
--because that would add 'value' to society... and it maybe true... but in my opinion it is inconclusive.
I dont understand, are you saying traders make the market more competitive?
--because that would add 'value' to society... and it maybe true... but in my opinion it is inconclusive.
I dont understand your argument, an airline can just buy a futures contract for next month.
my definition of trader is: never have intention to buy product- just trade price movement
-many traders dont even take the value of the product into consideration.
eg, buy high, sell higher.
yes... this is all very good.
but what value is being created?
Some of the value created is due to redistribution of risk. In effect the traders are insuring a risk and are making a profit from doing so and thus counter-parties can create more value because their risk is reduced. Overall society is better off as a whole with insurance/risk redistribution. Many people seem to think insurance is a bad bet because the insurer makes a profit but actually both parties usually benefit. Mathematically this is due to the utility of money not being linear.
One of the best things about being unemployed is that I get lots of time to spend with my kids. Which is where I have been for the last four hours - up the park, playing on swings etc. And perfect weather for it as well - a beautiful, warm, Sydney day. And a very useful contribution to society in bringing my kids up to be responsible members of society.
Am somewhat surprisedat the amount of heat generated by my fairly innocuous (and to me obviously factual) post on the social value of day trading. I am unemployed, I have a share portfolio - these are facts. If I do nothing all day, but live on my dividends and capital growth, is that making a contribution to society? Sure I buy things and generate activity that way. But I do not make anything or service anything - I rely on others to do this. Given I am unemployed, I might expect to be called a bludger (although I am not on the dole), but I would be surprised if people said I made a great contribution to society by having a share portfolio. However, posters on this thread appear to think that if you are in my situation, but sit in front of a screen all day and make a few trades, then you suddenly make a great contribution to society.
Come on, seriously guys, if you want to make your money that way fine, but accept the reality that you are not making much of a contribution. But hey probably better than marketing cigarettes and whisky.
Gooner has a thick skin - has to given Arsenal's failure to win anything for a while, so looking forward to more responses.
Got an interview this week, so wish me luck.
Am somewhat surprisedat the amount of heat generated by my fairly innocuous (and to me obviously factual) post on the social value of day trading.
Anyone employed adds to society through taxes I would have thought. When has 'adding to society' been the prime motivation(if any) for getting a job?
It's an odd thing to bring out.
so when i donate a % of my income each year to charity, i'm not helping society?
when i pay tax each year that doesnt help society ?
when i buy my stuffed olives etc at Woolies i'm not helping those young people stacking shelves and punching cash registers to earn some spare cash and gain job experience?
when i fill up my BMW with fuel (ok its a ford -- but it goes just as fast) that doesnt help either etc etc etc
95% of people dont work to 'help' society --- they work to earn money to look after their own 'society'
no offence Gooner, but a successful trader is indirectly (maybe inadvertently) adding a lot more value to society than u seem to realise
even an unsuccessful one who 'just' keeps himself off the dole is lowering the burden on the welfare system eh?
your view from a supposedly intelligent fella seems a little narrow minded
The value argument is a poor one. I don't think you are going to get a trader saying that they are more important than say, someone who cures cancer or discovers a life changing technology.
But if you think a capitalist system can work without price discovery that a large group of traders provide you are kidding yourself. They are just as important as any 1 level on a food chain. Take out the plankton and the whales starve to death.
Not really.
Its a reason.You and I value it as a poor reason.
My personal view is that its an excuse.
The REAL reason has not been put forward.
Only the poster knows this.
I liken it to selling a larger item.
Often you'll get all sorts of "excuses" why they won't purchase and a larger majority of the time the buyer will not tell you the REASON.
For example---I cant afford it (Real reason) as opposed to Your too expensive (excuse).
After stopping for a quick bite to eat at a McDonalds on the F3 on Saturday and seeing the type of society we have become (American mall society writ small), I'll withhold my contribution.
OK price discovery is important. There are hundreds of institutional traders and hedge funds moving billions around the market. Playing around with a few hundred k of equities really does not add much additional price discovery IMHO.
Looks like most of the people there would eat anything not bolted down.
Playing around with a few hundred k of equities really does not add much additional price discovery IMHO.
Who said a good day trader plays around with a few K
Its was not that uncommon for me to do 1 or 2 % of the aussie futs when I got going. And I know that most of the locals do far far more than me. They are day traders.
You clearly haven't a clue what a day trader actually does.
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