Are there any recommended trading courses?

LinSA said:

What do you mean? Do you mean I should examine the people I have spent money with before to compare to who I am looking at going with this time? They are worlds apart in the what they offer and what I can find on them.

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So are you saying that the educators with whom you have been dissatisfied, didn't have any favourable student testimonials and/or reviews?

No, I was naive. They were so good at their spiels that what they said sounded perfectly logical and fool proof. Turns out I was a fool, haha.

Several of the people offering courses in stocks have reviews but you can see they are just reviews saying 'just finished the bootcamp it was great', which really means nothing. Some stock course groups don't have reviews enabled, another tell tale sign.

But this one I am looking at has several reviews saying things like 'I have increased my savings by 15%' and 'I have finished my first year and made 19% profit', well things kind of like that. So that to me is a good sign. And that they have a group for people who have joined the course to discuss everything, plus I was able to get in touch with previous participants to see how they have gone.

So it certainly seems very different. I am just extra cautious, and when I see non favourable comments in groups like this it makes me wonder if I am just being foolish again. So that led me to ask whether what I am looking at makes sense or if there is another better way to learn.

LinSA said:

But this one I am looking at has several reviews saying things like 'I have increased my savings by 15%' and 'I have finished my first year and made 19% profit', well things kind of like that. So that to me is a good sign.

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Lin, I don't mean to be cynical but reviews on the internet are next to worthless. There are more fake reviews on the internet than real ones. The only evidence that someone can trade profitably is broker statements that demonstrate profitable trading. Everything else is just talk.

Why not start with a book for $50 instead of a course for $5000? The outlay is a lot smaller and you will at least learn the basics of the stock market in the process.

LinSA said:

No, I was naive. They were so good at their spiels that what they said sounded perfectly logical and fool proof. Turns out I was a fool, haha.

Several of the people offering courses in stocks have reviews but you can see they are just reviews saying 'just finished the bootcamp it was great', which really means nothing. Some stock course groups don't have reviews enabled, another tell tale sign.

But this one I am looking at has several reviews saying things like 'I have increased my savings by 15%' and 'I have finished my first year and made 19% profit', well things kind of like that. So that to me is a good sign. And that they have a group for people who have joined the course to discuss everything, plus I was able to get in touch with previous participants to see how they have gone.

So it certainly seems very different. I am just extra cautious, and when I see non favourable comments in groups like this it makes me wonder if I am just being foolish again. So that led me to ask whether what I am looking at makes sense or if there is another better way to learn.

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I know of a number of other "educators" with whom similarly favourable reviews and testimonials feature. Suffice to say, upon meeting with actual past graduates and speaking with them at greater length,the reality fell a long way short of the impression given by the published testimonials.

However, I cannot speak directly to the quality of Terry Tran's particular offering/s, as I have never studied his materials nor been engaged in discussion about such with anyone who has.

You mentioned speaking to a couple of people who have already done the course.
When and how did you first make their acquaintance?

Like all business its all about the Numbers.

Same with Property
Same with Trading
Same with coin collecting
Same with Art investment.

Income exceeds expenditure.

I posted this a few years ago.
With regard to TRADING


There are NO SECRETS and here they are!

Firstly ALL analysis "works" in a bull market. Anyone can make a profit in a strongly trending bull market--just ask your local taxi driver.

Its pretty common knowledge and one of the TRUE truisms of trading/investing that the market will trend 30% of the time and either distribute or accumulate in consolidations during the other times--70 %.

Its also true that there will be trends in sometime frame at any one time--during consolidations.

So if we are going to trade/invest profitably we best be able to recognise that we need to find a trend 2 bars or more--in a time frame so we can profit.

Our analysis---at best--- points us to set-ups which give us the ability to anticipate price action both--- Fundamental and Technical. At best its a 50/50 result over very long periods but by identifying where we are in a move (Consolidation or Trend) in a time frame we can be better prepared to trade or invest in the time frame chosen.

We should be constantly looking for set-ups which point to a trend --- be it within a lower time-frame in a consolidation or a breakout in any time frame.

Most trends last longer than expected and most consolidations resist breaking out in either direction longer than expected.
In the short term we can identify time periods which are likely to trend in a direction for a number of bars ( Trend or Counter trend trades).This can swing the odds in our favour---giving us one string to the bow of profit---anticipation.

Radge once said that " It doesn't matter if your wrong---only how long you stay wrong "

So the best way to minimise loss through being wrong too long is to have either a stop loss---OR a mechanism in your analysis which tells you that your analysis is wrong---quick enough to mitigate risk.

"Let your winners run"
The next string to the bow. You need to have either an anticipated target OR a mechanism to determine the end of your trading trend in your time frame which maximises your time in a trade in your chosen direction.

You see there are ONLY 3 ways (Other than Arbitrage) That you can profit from your Trading/Investing.

More aggregate wining profitable trades than aggregate losing trades.
OR
Bigger aggregate Winning trades to Aggregate losing trades.
OR
A combination of both.

So in that thread I mentioned that it doesn't matter if you find your analysis doesn't pan out or you read it wrong.
The reason.

If you know the above and you've put those understandings in place you'll be trading time frames and set-ups that in the long run will deliver you positive expectancy through your trade management and the understanding that there are NO SECRETS.

The traders trap is to constantly buy that new book or try that new trading technique
in the hope that it will find and give an EDGE.

That edge is staring you in the face
REGARDLESS OF METHOD USED.

LinSa,
Start with a few books, they are pretty cheap. Try Darryl Guppy 'Trend Trading' and then Mark Douglas 'Trading in the Zone' will help you develop the right mind set.
Alan Hull and Nick Radge and their newsletters are the real deal, if you find you want to use a signal service(and no harm in that). They both have courses (or they used to) which are not a waste of money.
And if you don't want to be a slave to your trading business, try weekly charts/systems.

greggles said:

Lin, I don't mean to be cynical but reviews on the internet are next to worthless. There are more fake reviews on the internet than real ones. The only evidence that someone can trade profitably is broker statements that demonstrate profitable trading. Everything else is just talk.

Why not start with a book for $50 instead of a course for $5000? The outlay is a lot smaller and you will at least learn the basics of the stock market in the process.

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& cynic also...
The reviews are on Facebook, so all individual real profiles, as in you can click and look at the profiles. Plus I contacted some who live in Australia and my same state and had a chat to them about it. I wasn't going to be satisfied this time with a first name only on a web page, I wanted to speak to real people. There is also a 14 day money back guarantee and in that time I will be able to go into the facebook group which has about 280 people and have a good chat to them.

Book wise, look I am even stumbling over tech/a's response, I just feel having kids has dumbed me down too much to be able to wrap my head around anything too complicated. I was very cluey, so I have a chance, just got to wake up my brain cells again. So I am hoping to find something really easy, basic, to get my head around it all, and then I can move up in my knowledge from there as I am aware I will need to study for years to be really proficient in my understanding of this.

A side question, I am hoping to be able to work for an hour a day studying stocks (once I have done my learning about how to do all of this of course), put in my purchase requests (talking US stocks) and try to average 1.25% per month (or 15% per year). Does that sound reasonable or ridiculous? Some of the people I spoke to from the course were gaining more than that in their first year.

Is there a reason to go with US stocks?

LinSA said:

Book wise, look I am even stumbling over tech/a's response, I just feel having kids has dumbed me down too much to be able to wrap my head around anything too complicated. I was very cluey, so I have a chance, just got to wake up my brain cells again. So I am hoping to find something really easy, basic, to get my head around it all, and then I can move up in my knowledge from there as I am aware I will need to study for years to be really proficient in my understanding of this.

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Lin, your error is believing that becoming a profitable trader is easy and that all you need to do is a course where a "guru" shows you how its done and then you start making easy money. That's a dream, not reality. It doesn't work like that, but the spruikers want you to believe it does because their job is selling you a product to make themselves rich, not you.

If doing a course was all you needed to become successful at something you would already be a successful property investor based on the amount of money you have spent on property courses. That didn't work out, so now you are looking for another way to make easy money. Easy money is a dream. Success in anything is a long road paved by hard work and perseverance.

Here's a book that is widely considered a classic: Come Into My Trading Room : A Complete Guide to Trading

It is exactly 1.157% the cost of a $5,000 course. Doesn't it make sense to dip your toes in first and see if trading financial markets is for you?

greggles said:

Lin, your error is believing that becoming a profitable trader is easy and that all you need to do is a course where a "guru" shows you how its done and then you start making easy money. That's a dream, not reality. It doesn't work like that, but the spruikers want you to believe it does because their job is selling you a product to make themselves rich, not you.

If doing a course was all you needed to become successful at something you would already be a successful property investor based on the amount of money you have spent on property courses. That didn't work out, so now you are looking for another way to make easy money. Easy money is a dream. Success in anything is a long road paved by hard work and perseverance.

Here's a book that is widely considered a classic: Come Into My Trading Room : A Complete Guide to Trading

It is exactly 1.157% the cost of a $5,000 course. Doesn't it make sense to dip your toes in first and see if trading financial markets is for you?

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I never actually said I wanted to make easy money, and I thought I could just do a really quick course and become rich. I think you have taken what I have said out of context. I expect to study, spend years of learning, and then more years learning more. What I have said is I don't have the brain capacity to weave my way through hundreds of books and online articles trying to work out a whole lot of complicated information. I either need to find the best ones to look at, or find a course that will weed out all the garble for me and give me a good starting place of understanding from where I can start to dip my toes while I continue to learn more.

With the property course, even then I didn't expect easy. I spent many many hours through the night trying their methods to find in the end that what they told me I could do from Australia around my family could not actually be done and I realistically had to travel over to US, which for family and monetary reasons I could not. So again, not looking for easy, more than prepared to put in the work, but that learning is all useless to me if I cannot go over there.

I have come in to see if I am silly to spend $5000 for somebody to weed out that garble and get me to a starting point for me to continue my learning with a better understanding, or if there is another method that can get me to that same point without too much confusion and in the same amount of time.

LinSA said:

A side question, I am hoping to be able to work for an hour a day studying stocks (once I have done my learning about how to do all of this of course), put in my purchase requests (talking US stocks) and try to average 1.25% per month (or 15% per year). Does that sound reasonable or ridiculous? Some of the people I spoke to from the course were gaining more than that in their first year.

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What if I were to say you may be able to get returns like that or more spending 30 mins a week or 30 mins a month? Without looking at charts saying, should this trend line go here or there, what about this support line, hmmm, etc.

80% plus of being able to make money from the market is physocological.

20% or less is technical.

Beginners don't realise this and search and search and search for the magic methods to make money, 'the holy grail'. They buy book after book, do course after course. Also referred to as the beginners cycle by my mentor.

Sometimes it just never clicks for them as they can't get their head around the physocological aspect which is the most important part. You may not realise this until you begin.

You may spend $5k on this course you are talking about, find out all the pieces of his method but then can't trade it over the long term due to physocological factors or it doesn't fit with your lifestyle. if you have a string of losers will you stop, if you go into draw down will you stop, if it takes up to much time will you stop.

Will you have enough confidence in yourself to keep taking trades when you encounter difficulties. Will you start to doubt yourself or the method when things don't go as expected. Where are your expectations coming from.

These are rhetorical questions, but it is likely you will encounter them and many more if you start to trade, regardless of which methods (or from whom you learn them or how much you pay for them), you chose to apply to the market.

The mentor where it all clicked into place for me was and still is Nick Radge of the Chartist, https://www.thechartist.com.au/Press/moving-averages-podcast-with-nick-radge.html this is a very recent 30 min podcast interview and will give you a flavour for Nick and his ideas.

Good luck with your journey.

Triathlete said:

Is there a reason to go with US stocks?

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From what I have been told, and what little I know, I can put orders to purchase and go to bed with US stocks. Can't with Australian, and there is apparently more opportunity over there? That is all I know though.

LinSA said:

From what I have been told, and what little I know, I can put orders to purchase and go to bed with US stocks. Can't with Australian, and there is apparently more opportunity over there? That is all I know though.

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Who told you that rubbish???

I have been trading CFD"s and short selling in one ASX top 50 stock and been averaging 8% a month over the last 5 months...

willy1111 said:

What if I were to say you may be able to get returns like that or more spending 30 mins a week or 30 mins a month? Without looking at charts saying, should this trend line go here or there, what about this support line, hmmm, etc.

80% plus of being able to make money from the market is physocological.

20% or less is technical.

Beginners don't realise this and search and search and search for the magic methods to make money, 'the holy grail'. They buy book after book, do course after course. Also referred to as the beginners cycle by my mentor.

Sometimes it just never clicks for them as they can't get their head around the physocological aspect which is the most important part. You may not realise this until you begin.

The mentor where it all clicked into place for me was and still is Nick Radge of the Chartist, https://www.thechartist.com.au/Press/moving-averages-podcast-with-nick-radge.html this is a very recent 30 min podcast interview and will give you a flavour for Nick and his ideas.

Good luck with your journey.

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Are you talking belief, manifesting? I am doing a lot of work around that right now alongside this. I know one thing about stocks, they seem really exciting. Based on my experience with things I have done in the past, and what I love to do, it does sound like something I would really enjoy having a go at and trying to succeed at.

LinSA said:

I never actually said I wanted to make easy money, and I thought I could just do a really quick course and become rich. I think you have taken what I have said out of context. I expect to study, spend years of learning, and then more years learning more. What I have said is I don't have the brain capacity to weave my way through hundreds of books and online articles trying to work out a whole lot of complicated information. I either need to find the best ones to look at, or find a course that will weed out all the garble for me and give me a good starting place of understanding from where I can start to dip my toes while I continue to learn more.

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If I have misrepresented what you are setting out to achieve, then I apologise. Just understand that it's not possible to make things so simple that you eliminate all complexity and "weed out all the garble" completely. There is a certain amount of complexity that is inherent, but if you start from the beginning with learning and understanding simple concepts you can build your knowledge slowly. That is really the only way and it's not easy but it doesn't have to be expensive.

LinSA said:

With the property course, even then I didn't expect easy. I spent many many hours through the night trying their methods to find in the end that what they told me I could do from Australia around my family could not actually be done and I realistically had to travel over to US, which for family and monetary reasons I could not. So again, not looking for easy, more than prepared to put in the work, but that learning is all useless to me if I cannot go over there.

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At least you have learned from your experiences with real estate courses that expensive courses do not equal success.

LinSA said:

I have come in to see if I am silly to spend $5000 for somebody to weed out that garble and get me to a starting point for me to continue my learning with a better understanding, or if there is another method that can get me to that same point without too much confusion and in the same amount of time.

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Yes, I honestly think you would be making a mistake by going down that route. You will waste a lot of your valuable capital unnecessarily. There is nothing a $5,000 trading course can teach you that you can't learn from a good book on the same topic for much less. Spending more doesn't get you more.

Make a note of some of the suggested books in this thread and investigate further.

greggles said:

If I have misrepresented what you are setting out to achieve, then I apologise. Just understand that it's not possible to make things so simple that you eliminate all complexity and "weed out all the garble" completely. There is a certain amount of complexity that is inherent, but if you start from the beginning with learning and understanding simple concepts you can build your knowledge slowly. That is really the only way and it's not easy but it doesn't have to be expensive.


At least you have learned from your experiences with real estate courses that expensive courses do not equal success.


Yes, I honestly think you would be making a mistake by going down that route. You will waste a lot of your valuable capital unnecessarily. There is nothing a $5,000 trading course can teach you that you can't learn from a good book on the same topic for much less. Spending more doesn't get you more.

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Thank you. Yes I sure did learn, thus why coming in and being painful about asking about a measly $5,000. But really we don't have a lot left to start our journey with so I need to be careful.

A question for you.... could I potentially lose more than $5,000 in mistakes by ending up reading the wrong information or missing important points that others have learned the hard way? That is what I was thinking the course might offer over the books and really the ONLY reason I am considering it. I could be wrong, of course that is why I have come in here, but my inkling and with the success of the students who have done his course is that maybe he can point out the pointers I might miss?

LinSA said:

I have come in to see if I am silly to spend $5000 for somebody to weed out that garble and get me to a starting point for me to continue my learning with a better understanding, or if there is another method that can get me to that same point without too much confusion and in the same amount of time.

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This is a strategy (the 20% part).

Weekend Trend Trader available on Amazon Kindle or
https://www.thechartist.com.au/e-Books/product/16-weekend-trend-trader-ebook.html

For less than $10.

Simulations of this strategy from 1995 to 2012 show compounded returns in excess of 20%p.a.

I wouldn't be spending $5k, I would start with the above.

LinSA said:

Thank you. Yes I sure did learn, thus why coming in and being painful about asking about a measly $5,000. But really we don't have a lot left to start our journey with so I need to be careful.

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If you don't have a lot left to start your journey then why spend $5,000? It's not a "measly" amount, it's a lot of money.

LinSA said:

A question for you.... could I potentially lose more than $5,000 in mistakes by ending up reading the wrong information or missing important points that others have learned the hard way? That is what I was thinking the course might offer over the books and really the ONLY reason I am considering it. I could be wrong, of course that is why I have come in here, but my inkling and with the success of the students who have done his course is that maybe he can point out the pointers I might miss?

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The best way to answer that question is to examine the assumption that a $5,000 trading course contains better or more useful information than a $50 trading book. Turn it around. Could you potentially lose more by relying on a $5,000 trading course than a trading book that has been in publication for 15 or 20 years because that course might give you wrong information or miss important points?

Why do you think the course is more likely to contain better or more information than the book other than having an "inkling" that it may be so?

Ok, how about this... I will spend the next two months learning as much as I can. If I get into August and I am more confused than ever, I will look into the course again. So any recommendations (and I will look at your messages above) for good non rambling books, online resources etc, I would really appreciate.

And Willy1111 I am intrigued by what you are saying so will go and have a look.

Thanks all.