NBN Rollout Scrapped

[drsmith]

You completely missed the point. Telstra is being paid to decommission copper, yes. But they actually have to do something to get that $1500 and maintain the rest of the CAN in the process. Under the Libs proposal, Telstra get's paid the same amount to walk away from the cooper en mass once a fibre node is connected, fantastic! That's what Turnbull appears to be saying.

That may be reading too much specific contractual detail from what he is saying.

 

[tinhat]

Ok, let's dissect this little piece of polly babble. Yes, Telstra is being paid to decommission each premises end point connection, copper out, fibre in and $1500 thanks. Now if you say to Telstra "give us your copper" when we connect fibre to a street node and we will pay you $1500 for each copper connection to that node that is "connected to the NBN" (and all will be), Telstra will laugh all the way to the bank (seriously looking at TLS shares again). Thanks for the quote, this has to be one of the most poorly considered and phrased statements I have seen from Turnbull to date.

The problem with Turnbill and all his ilk is that they somehow don't realise they are no longer in the school first debating team and that the bollocks that flows out of their mouth has even less intellectual rigour than the idiots they are debating against.

Turnbill is a convert to Catholicism out of his own free will. It takes a lonely boy to turn to the Church for comfort. A lot of the rest of the senior ranks of the Liberal/Country party are Jesuit educated Catholics. The Pope is a Jesuit - God bless him - none of us ever realised that a back night of the church could rule the white knights. There you go, as if it even matters in this day and age.

It seems however that the Jesuits are good at producing good debaters but alas they can't substitute intellectualism for intelligence - despite their historic reputation for brilliant astrology they have little skill in alchemy!

So we have a bunch of intellectual lightweights running the Liberal/Country coalition who don't realise that just because the other team are completely bankrupt of any moral fibre and genuine purpose they too are completely lacking in the intelligence to ever deliver on their own banal platitudes.

Chairman Malcolm of the People's Democratic Republic of Australia. (Revolution now, broadband later).

 

[moXJO]

Wow dud policy libs.

 

[overhang]

Malcolm's Turnbull's analogy.
"MALCOLM TURNBULL: No, you - provision for demand where it is today and in the foreseeable future. You don't - taking the approach of building - investing in infrastructure on the basis that you think It'll be needed in 20 years time, which is what Stephen Conroy is fond of saving, that could be said only by someone who doesn't care about taxpayers' money. You invest in infrastructure to cater for the demand today and in the foreseeable future and build into your plans the flexibility to expand further, if and when or as demand increases and that way, of course you take advantage of the latest developments in technology as you go."

This seems illogical to me, since when do we build infrastructure based on current demand? The West Gate Bridge didn't need 4 lanes back in the 70s but it certainly does now. The NBN is either build it once and build it right or don't build it at all.

 

[Calliope]

This seems illogical to me, since when do we build infrastructure based on current demand?

Asylum seekers detention centres perhaps?

MALCOLM TURNBULL: No, you - provision for demand where it is today and in the foreseeable future.

 

[chiff]

What I do know is that we had to get Wifi when the copper wires to us were unreliable.Telstra ,despite many efforts,were unable to provide an acceptable ADSL2 broadband service.

 

[sydboy007]

It will be very interesting to see what the anticipated

* number of nodes will be
* opex to run said nodes
* cost of copper upgrades and maintenance over the next 10 years
* how long Telstra stall in their negotiations with a LNP Govt since they already have a signed contract and would be in no rush to lose their prime asset for anything less that full price.
* how much it will cost to redesign the NBN from the current rollout to a FTTN setup.
* who chooses the "impartial" committe to run the numbers over the two NBNs (I think we all know a Govt will only set up a committee so long as it can set the terms or reference in a way to give the answer they want)


I'm still not sure who "owns" the node. Is it NBN or ?????

Does a whole area get cut over to a node at the same time, or do you have to request it?

How will they cope with the lack of records detailing exchange main cable pair to pillar then pillar to premises as few of the records are up to date so I can see a lot of time wasted trying to sync these back up - major outages for end users as well.

 

[sptrawler]

This seems illogical to me, since when do we build infrastructure based on current demand? The West Gate Bridge didn't need 4 lanes back in the 70s but it certainly does now. The NBN is either build it once and build it right or don't build it at all.

On that basis, why wasn't it made 6, 8 or 10 lanes?
By your logic, evenyually you will need them.
Applying the same reasoning, why wasn't the road over the Nullabor made 4 lanes.
Eventually you will need it.

For every piece of infrastructure you build, some other infrastructure doesn't get built, or is defered.

That is unless you just, spend, spend, spend.
Then you get to a position where nothing gets built.

 

[NBNMyths]

MALCOLM TURNBULL: No, you - provision for demand where it is today and in the foreseeable future.

At this growth rate, how long before demand exceeds the ability of the Coalition's obsolete FTTN? Not very long. As always, the "foreseeable future" for the Coalition only gets them to the next election.

 

[NBNMyths]

You can see why they leaked it to their mates at News Ltd a few days ago. They wouldn't want comments like these showing up on the day they released their policy:


Geoff Huston, chief scientist of regional internet registry Asia-Pacific Network Information Centre and a former Telstra employee, said:

"What [the Coalition] is trying to say is 'what we do now on the internet is what we will do in the next 30 years'. What stupid nonsense! What we were doing 30 years ago modems could handle," Mr Huston said.
"I would side with the view that this [policy] is indeed a lemon."

Sharing Mr Huston's concerns, senior lecturer at RMIT University's school of electrical and computer engineering, Mark Gregory, said

the Coalition's policy would harm the economy and would not future-proof the country's internet infrastructure.
''They're going to be putting Australia behind the rest of the world,'' Dr Gregory said of the Coalition's plan.

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...there-first-20130409-2hjiw.html#ixzz2Q0uLo7nk

 

[MrBurns]

At this growth rate, how long before demand exceeds the ability of the Coalition's obsolete FTTN? Not very long. As always, the "foreseeable future" for the Coalition only gets them to the next election.

Seems your slant on this is based on political bias

My slant on this is based on personal observation, I wouldn't trust Gillard or Conroy with anything let alone a project of this size so unless you think the Greens could handle it it's up to the Libs.....As Always.

 

[NBNMyths]

Seems your slant on this is based on political bias

My slant on this is based on personal observation, I wouldn't trust Gillard or Conroy with anything let alone a project of this size so unless you think the Greens could handle it it's up to the Libs.....As Always.

I would LOVE them to say "We think Labor are managing this project badly. We will take over and build it more efficiently".

But that isn't what they are doing. Of course it's faster and cheaper to build a tent instead of a house. Doesn't mean it's sensible.

 

[sptrawler]

You can see why they leaked it to their mates at News Ltd a few days ago. They wouldn't want comments like these showing up on the day they released their policy:


Geoff Huston, chief scientist of regional internet registry Asia-Pacific Network Information Centre and a former Telstra employee, said:

Sharing Mr Huston's concerns, senior lecturer at RMIT University's school of electrical and computer engineering, Mark Gregory, said



http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...there-first-20130409-2hjiw.html#ixzz2Q0uLo7nk

Somewhat like quoting, some health experts on a decission to spending more or less in the health services field.

Or asking AGL or Origin energy if they would like billions of public money spent on "super conductor" development and deployment.

The bias will be obvious, depending on the answer you want.

Running fibre to every house, is a gross waste of money.IMO
The election will prove what the silent majority think.

 

[MrBurns]

I would LOVE
But that isn't what they are doing. Of course it's faster and cheaper to build a tent instead of a house. Doesn't mean it's sensible.

You forget Labor haven't finished anything , the only project they've finished is trashing our surplus.

We can only afford a tent thanks to the socialist looters and they couldn't even deliver that so step aside and let some responsible people step in.

 

[sptrawler]

I would LOVE them to say "We think Labor are managing this project badly. We will take over and build it more efficiently".

But that isn't what they are doing. Of course it's faster and cheaper to build a tent instead of a house. Doesn't mean it's sensible.

Again an opinion.
I think the comparison is more like a 4 bedroom 1 bathroom or a massive palace.
I suppose it depends who you are housing.

Then again, maybe everyone will take the palace, if they think someone else is paying for it. I don't suscribe to that belief.

Somewhat like the massive public outdry we are hearing in the press, depends who you listen to and what you want to hear.

This article somewhat puts it in perspective.
http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/po...i-cry-foul-over-fraudband-20130410-2hkdq.html

Personaly I am of the belief, most people don't care wether it's 50mb/s or 100mb/s. I may be wrong, the election will say.

 

[drsmith]

Chairman Malcolm of the People's Democratic Republic of Australia. (Revolution now, broadband later).

He must have done something right.

You're playing the man.

 

[drsmith]

Wow dud policy libs.

From the project where it stands the next election, what else could have they done other than FTTH ?

I ask this not as a criticism of the above viewpoint, but as an open question to the floor.

 

[Ves]

Personaly I am of the belief, most people don't care wether it's 50mb/s or 100mb/s. I may be wrong, the election will say.

Except, you, me and every other rational person knows that this issue will not be the one that decides, or even heavily influences the election result.

There's a saying about democracy. You can take any two idiots, and their shared opinion will always matter more than the most intelligent person in the country.

 

[McLovin]

The government hasn't been able to borrow at such low rates of interest in generations. I say build a decent network that will still be scalable (is that the right IT term?) in 20, 30, 40, 50 years' time. No point building another Spit Bridge, or M5 East. And I'd much rather my money was spent doing something that benefits the country than being squandered on property tax breaks, propping up the super balances of millionaires or being handed out to middle class families so they can afford their annual trip to Bali.

 

[overhang]

On that basis, why wasn't it made 6, 8 or 10 lanes?
By your logic, evenyually you will need them.
Applying the same reasoning, why wasn't the road over the Nullabor made 4 lanes.
Eventually you will need it.

For every piece of infrastructure you build, some other infrastructure doesn't get built, or is defered.

That is unless you just, spend, spend, spend.
Then you get to a position where nothing gets built.

Actually to stick with the roads analogy the coalitions plan is the equivalent of building the bridge with 4 lanes but having a gravel road leading up to the bridge (a gravel road with no maintenance). Like I say build it once and build it right or don't build it at all.

I'm curious to those of you who have rigorously opposed the NBN from the outset, how do you feel about the coalitions policy? Do you support the coalitions policy or is this simply a matter that you believe broadband infrastructure should be left to the free market to decide, in which case naturally you'd support the cheaper option between the two parties?