The terrorists have won

[wayneL]

The objective of terrorism is to inject constant fear into the lives of a population.

Mission accomplished.

The only thing I'm wondering, is who are the terrorists? A few malcontents hiding in caves or our western governments and mainstream media?

Someone made this observation:

Real terrorism is played down by governments.
False terrorism is played up by governments.

I wonder.

 

[Bluesky]

The objective of terrorism is to inject constant fear into the lives of a population.

Mission accomplished.

The only thing I'm wondering, is who are the terrorists? A few malcontents hiding in caves or our western governments and mainstream media?

Someone made this observation:

Real terrorism is played down by governments.
False terrorism is played up by governments.

I wonder.

Good to see some ppl have an open mind, u are 100% correct

 

[disarray]

no, the object of terrorism is to effect change by injecting constant fear into the lives of the population. it is pointless creating terror for terrors sake, it is a method for enforcing your ideals on others.

i don't see any evidence of changes moving society towards fulfilling the "terrorists" goals. sure we have tighter security and some restricted liberties, but that doesn't go far towards building an islamic state. all it really does is piss people off and make them dislike muslims more than they already do.

i don't see much evidence that the population is scared. just because the government and media ramp it up doesn't mean people are paying attention to it. many people don't trust the government, while many others are either too stupid or too self-absorbed to notice what is going on anyway

dramatic forum posts aside, the terrorists have not won, they haven't created a culture of fear despite the blatherings of zero iq tv and they certainly haven't accomplished anything resembling a mission.

so who are the terrorists? they are islamic fundamentalists who wish to bring in sharia law and extend the historic islamic caliphate. do they have any chance of effecting this in australia? none whatsoever.

another thing is the monocultural viewpoint taken by both sides of the "terrorist" campaign. its the same with aborigines. it's always culture A vs. white people, or religion B vs. christianity and this is far too narrow. australia has a huge asian population who seem to be conveniently left out of the ramblings of both left and right of the political and religious equation. definately a silent section of the population there, putting their heads down and working hard to make things happen.

anyone with any sense already knows governments and the media cannot be trusted, and their purpose is to push their own agendas and maintain some level of control over society. the sheeple will always be led, so make sure you and yours think for themselves and forge their own path wherever possible.

 

[2020hindsight]

I would say the terrorists have won at least a battle, a milestone, namely to instill fear.
have they won hearts and minds? - pretty difficult when there are people's hearts etc splattered all over the place.
have they won "the war"?
let's define our terms before going there.

but lets just say, the "good guys" (and who are they?) sure as hell don't seem to be winning at the moment - either battle or war .

 

[123enen]

Talk about instilling fear.....
I remember when this new "anti-terror" legislation was introduced ,the scaremongers amongst us were up in arms protesting how dangerous it would be.

I remember the scaremongers saying that a suspect could be arrested under this legislation and "disappear". The suspect would not be able to contact anyone to advise his/her status and nobody was allowed to discuss the situation. People could be arrested and the world would not know what was going on.

Well, let me say the whole world knew what this man was going through.
Everybody knew where he was and his safety and well being was assured through this unpleasant ordeal.

 

[caribean]

"Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger."
-- Herman Goering at the Nuremberg trials

No comment.....

 

[wayneL]

i don't see any evidence of changes moving society towards fulfilling the "terrorists" goals. sure we have tighter security and some restricted liberties, but that doesn't go far towards building an islamic state. all it really does is piss people off and make them dislike muslims more than they already do.

Missed the point.

When you consider the government and media are more responsible for the promulgation of fear than a few Muslim malcontents, then it is the gu'mint and the media who are the actual terrorists. This being the case, there is massive evidence that "terrorist goals" are indeed being achieved. eg The restriction of civil liberties which you mention.

Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.

 

[wayneL]

Talk about instilling fear.....
I remember when this new "anti-terror" legislation was introduced ,the scaremongers amongst us were up in arms protesting how dangerous it would be.

I remember the scaremongers saying that a suspect could be arrested under this legislation and "disappear". The suspect would not be able to contact anyone to advise his/her status and nobody was allowed to discuss the situation. People could be arrested and the world would not know what was going on.

Well, let me say the whole world knew what this man was going through.
Everybody knew where he was and his safety and well being was assured through this unpleasant ordeal.

The fact remains that the legislation is in place and the potential still remains.

 

[wayneL]

Whatever happened to the stoic Anglo-Celtic tradition, the stiff upper lip, the Blitz Spirit, the iron resolve, not to be intimidated into cowering, sniveling, fear riddled panty-waists, being told by how much to be scared by either a manipulating gu'mint or a few radicals who are statistically far less dangerous than the local hoodlums.

That's what I want to know.

I mean have you seen the regulations regarding taking toothpaste onto a plane... after that whole scare was completely discredited?

How long before we all have one of these http://www.livescience.com/technology/060531_rfid_chips.html

 

[>Apocalypto<]

The objective of terrorism is to inject constant fear into the lives of a population.

Mission accomplished.

The only thing I'm wondering, is who are the terrorists? A few malcontents hiding in caves or our western governments and mainstream media?

Someone made this observation:

Real terrorism is played down by governments.
False terrorism is played up by governments.

I wonder.

Great thread Wayne,

 

[Smurf1976]

Well, let me say the whole world knew what this man was going through.
Everybody knew where he was and his safety and well being was assured through this unpleasant ordeal.

Your argument is speculation backed up by a single example. For all you and I know, there could be another 100 locked away that we've never heard about. We have no idea as to what is actually going on - and that's the greatest danger.

 

[moneymajix]

My opinion is this - don't give it energy.

Focusing on it gives it more power.

No more posts from me on this topic.

LOL.

 

[kitehigh]

no, the object of terrorism is to effect change by injecting constant fear into the lives of the population. it is pointless creating terror for terrors sake, it is a method for enforcing your ideals on others.

i don't see any evidence of changes moving society towards fulfilling the "terrorists" goals. sure we have tighter security and some restricted liberties, but that doesn't go far towards building an islamic state. all it really does is piss people off and make them dislike muslims more than they already do.

i don't see much evidence that the population is scared. just because the government and media ramp it up doesn't mean people are paying attention to it. many people don't trust the government, while many others are either too stupid or too self-absorbed to notice what is going on anyway

dramatic forum posts aside, the terrorists have not won, they haven't created a culture of fear despite the blatherings of zero iq tv and they certainly haven't accomplished anything resembling a mission.

so who are the terrorists? they are islamic fundamentalists who wish to bring in sharia law and extend the historic islamic caliphate. do they have any chance of effecting this in australia? none whatsoever.

another thing is the monocultural viewpoint taken by both sides of the "terrorist" campaign. its the same with aborigines. it's always culture A vs. white people, or religion B vs. christianity and this is far too narrow. australia has a huge asian population who seem to be conveniently left out of the ramblings of both left and right of the political and religious equation. definately a silent section of the population there, putting their heads down and working hard to make things happen.

anyone with any sense already knows governments and the media cannot be trusted, and their purpose is to push their own agendas and maintain some level of control over society. the sheeple will always be led, so make sure you and yours think for themselves and forge their own path wherever possible.

Great post disarray.

I agree with your sentiments 100%.

I sugguest people watch the documentary "obsession" and you will get a good understanding of the fundalmentalist movement.

 

[2020hindsight]

Whatever happened to the stoic Anglo-Celtic tradition, the Blitz Spirit, the iron resolve,.... a few radicals who are statistically far less dangerous than the local hoodlums......

well the Anglos and the Celcs have been bashing each other over the head for years, lol, so yes after a while you get used to it I guess

These new blokes use explosives m8! - potentially dirty nuclear stuff! - not if but when. remember the anthrax scare - real worry surely!

I think eternal vigilance every which way - not only against these loonies - but equally against spin doctoring and prejudice of any kind - exposure of frauds, mistakes, political spins

btw if you want exposure of the the bias of the press, no better place than "Media watch" - best damned show on TV

plenty of dicussion , etc - That's why I enjoy reading these posts
report strange behaviour, bags or cases left in public places etc - YOU BET.
people hanging around bridges etc. Sydney will get plenty of TV on this in the next few weeks believe me ( APEC coming up etc)

Make it so that Chaser has a hard job making our various security forces look foolish (although I personally don't know what I'd do if they approached me lol)

("pass the parcel" in an Irish pub - fastest game ever invented ! )
fear- yes , but controlled and enlightened, surely.

 

[2020hindsight]

btw if you want exposure of the the bias of the press, no better place than "Media watch" - best damned show on TV

MW always reminds me of that song "who takes care of the caretaker's daughter while the caretaker's busy taking care" : 1one cent

 

[Lounge Lizard]

Most people have added the thought of dying from terrorist attack to the myriad of other things you might die from. Car accident, shark attack, bee sting, accidentally cutting your throat while shaving in the morning etc etc. We're all pretty desensitised now. The only real threat from terrorism that remains is if some loony actually gets their hands on a WMD, whether it be be an islamist or some other flavour fruitcake.

It's a pity George, John and Tony just spent several hundred billion looking in the only place on earth where there probably isn't any liklehood of such a threat originating.

 

[disarray]

Missed the point.

When you consider the government and media are more responsible for the promulgation of fear than a few Muslim malcontents, then it is the gu'mint and the media who are the actual terrorists. This being the case, there is massive evidence that "terrorist goals" are indeed being achieved. eg The restriction of civil liberties which you mention.

i understand you are saying that the government are terrorists because they are pushing the fear. i am saying that people aren't scared of the government.

the restriction of civil liberties is just another play by the government for greater control over our lives. this is nothing new. it doesn't make them terrorists, it just makes them a government. and judging by the fact that the howard government has been in for several terms now, the majority of people seem to agree with these policies. does this make everyone who voted liberal a supporter of "terrorism"? i think not.

maybe people want greater security. maybe people are willing to give up some liberties in exchange for security against aggressive cultures who have taken root in the midst of our society. maybe, just maybe, people are sick of all the "i do what i want when i want" attitudes and the social problems that come with it and are looking for greater social cohesion and direction. maybe people are getting over liberalism because they see that people need control or we have disorder. maybe we need to bring back corporal punishment in schools and kick bad parents up the ass. maybe the times they are a'changin?

 

[Kimosabi]

ter·ror·ism

–noun

1. the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, esp. for political purposes.

2. the state of fear and submission produced by terrorism or terrorization.

3. a terroristic method of governing or of resisting a government.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/terrorism

 

[wayneL]

i understand you are saying that the government are terrorists because they are pushing the fear. i am saying that people aren't scared of the government.

No they're not scared of the government, that's not their goal at this stage. But they are trying to make people unreasonably frightened of a terrorist threat, a threat that is blown out of all proportion to the actual risks in order to implement a different agenda.

It's working.

As far as the actual Islamist threat, we have the capabilities to fight that successfully without some of the absurd measures put in place, which I argue actually detract from our effectiveness in that aim.

 

[disarray]

people will never be more scared of the government than they are of incompatible immigrants. after decades of liberalism society is swinging to the right, mostly as a reaction to the changing nature of society.